Well, I've always thought Alice was a bit naive, but then she's a child. The rabbit is too frantic, the dormouse is boring and the Hatter is well......Mad. The cat's OK
I agree with Sen. Marco Rubio from Florida "Rubio criticised the caucus, saying "My fear has always been that if you start creating these little clubs or organizations in Washington run by politicians, the movement starts to lose its energy."
For those saying that Tea Party people are extremists out to destroy the nation, I ask - Do you honestly believe that Obama/Pelosi/Reid are acting in YOUR best interest?
Have we been so indoctrinated by the progressives that bigger government is the answer for all that ails us?
Have you totally discounted the Constitution? It clearly spells out the role of the federal government - which is nothing like what we have now. If socialization of a society holds such promise, how come it has never worked for the betterment of a people? Ever?
Are you so afraid of hard work, supporting yourself and your family that you welcome all the safety nets liberalism provides at such high a cost? A cost that has driven us to the brink of disaster?
Don't get me wrong - the republicans in office are almost as bad. I'm mad as hellat all of them.
Status quo= every household in this country carries a $30560.00 federal tax liability this year. If at the end of the year you haven't paid that much in taxes, you're just another middle class welfare recipient living off other peoples money.
Posted by terry paine on August 2, 2011 - 11:17am
Jason, what was is that the tea party wouldn't compromise on that was for the betterment of our county.
-I said nothing about the Tea Party. I was commenting on the far right's refusal to negotiate any tax increases, and the far left's refusal to cut spending on entitlements.
For weeks and weeks neither side was willing to compromise in the least. That's a problem. The two-party system is designed for both sides to be heard and to work together to come to compromise.
There was not so called tea party a few year ago..The liberals all called them names and wrote them off as nothing to worry about..the tea party is not made of off a bunch of rich people just a bunch of people who are sick and tired of the way both parties spend money..
who future are the protecting if not that of America..How are you spose to compromise on ones values...They believe in spending less and not adding to the huge debt we are all creating..Whats so wrong with cut cap and balance..Balance budget works in alot of states..Problem is 50% don't pay any federal taxes and they get most of the benefits..lets look at that..Flat Tax should be next on the tea party agenda..The tea party wants to cut out loops hole and exemptions for all..If you don't pay federal tax then you should not be getting money back at the end of the year...
Howard i am not...i am talking about the grassroots party..they made this spending an issue and the ones they elected responsed with making a stand on this debt ceiling issue...Just as Obama did when he was in Congress..Why doesn't the left take a stand and call him a terrorist for standing for what he believed in at that time.
Nobody during the elections that swept these Tea Party GOPers into power were talking about the debt ceiling, Mark. There was no call to "make a stand on the debt ceiling." It was a non-issue.
What was an issue was reducing spending.
That's not what we got from the TeaGOP. What we got was a lot of hot hair about reducing spending. We got a lie about how this deal will reduce spending. It actually increases spending, just not as fast as some imaginary projection dreamed up by bureaucrats.
If the TeaGOP was serious about reducing spending, they would be insisting on bringing all the troops home from overseas theaters, they would be talking about eliminating unneeded federal departments like the department of education, they would be talking about going to a flat or consumption tax and eliminating the IRS as we know it, they would be working on a serious plan to reduce medical expenses -- but they're not doing any of these things because they're hard and unpopular, no matter how necessary.
The TeaGOP doesn't give rat's ass about the American people, nor are they extremists. They exist as an arm of the GOP merely to fool gullible voters into protecting the perks and the power of the GOP and the cronies to donate to their campaigns.
We saw proof of that in our own backyard when the TeaGOP backed a party hack and loyalist like Jane Corwin for Congress rather than a grassroots Tea guy like David Bellavia.
Like them or not, no effort to try and cut spending would have taken place if the Tea party did not hols up the increase in the debt ceiling. That's been proven budget after budget.
Let's see now if the credit agencies still downgrade us since the "cuts" just made are really token cuts and over a ten year period.
John, the banks could care less what the Fed spends money on- as long as it spends money. Without the debt ceiling being raised, the banks wouldn't profit from more loans to the Fed. As for ending the wars: haven't you heard? The U. S. doesn't make washing machines anymore. The U. S. manufactures weaponry and munitions. No war- no profits.
Apparently these two points got missed somewhere along the line.
Seems to me that the Tea types left major cuts on the table because they were too busy being politicians to deal. They were more concerned with their pledges to special interest groups to make the wholesale changes that were needed. The deal was a joke that cut almost nothing and the Tea Party is worthless.
Charlie,
Again, if it was not for them, even the token cuts passed by moderates would not have been made. And most Tea Party members did not vote for this deal (neither did the hard core liberals). Next election I bet you see more hard core winners from both the right and left.
John, I hope we see more independents or at least representatives of other parties. Because that'll show that Americans are fed up with partisan politics. Thanking the tea partiers for this deal is like having your leg cut off and saying, it could be worse, I could have had both cut off. Sure it's less worse, but I won't thank them for leaving me on 1 leg.
Having more of either extreme would be the biggest waste ever. The Tea Party, whom I know a few of their following, are not bad people. They came about out of anger of decades of goverment stupidity, which is fine. What they became though is nothing more than an extension of the GOP.
The national GOP took ahold of them and now they are useless. Did they bring about change? No. Did they bring about discussion? Sure. Did their "Our way or the highway" rhetoric work? No, it created an atrocious mess.
The GOP establishment got what it wanted with their T-Party....no return of of the tax rates that help create 23,000,000 jobs during the Clinton administration....let's all celebrate the big GOP/T-Party win...
John, all this has proven is that hard core members get nothing accomplished. They simply are unable to compromise enough to make the tough decisions that are needed. The Tea Party is a failure and anyone who accepts that monicker is a nonstarter for one of my votes.
The idea that they left cuts on the table is disgraceful.
John, I think we can agree on that, no one is willing to accept the changes that are really needed. We need to cut everything and raise taxes on everyone. Until there are enough people willing to do that, none of this debate really matters. The death spiral will continue.
Vice President Joseph Robinette Biden Junior joined House Democrats in lashing tea party Republicans Monday, accusing them of having “acted like terrorists” in the fight over raising the nation’s debt limit.
Obviously number two didn’t get the memo from Obama’s teleprompter about the need for civil discourse.
Jason, I'd like to apologize for the sarcasm (it s a horrible habit I'm trying to break).
I overlooked in your first post references to the far wings of both parties, not just the tea party.
But do I think that my ideals should be forced upon someone? Yes, I'd like my idea of the government not forcing anyone to do anything to be forced upon everyone.
Is compromise necessary? Well, can something be necessary and not realistic? Let's see. The person I would want to represent me would not want to drop 124 scud missiles in Libya. So tell me, what would a compromise look like in that instance? Would it be to only drop 62 missiles?
Many failed government programs are the result of politicians compromising (to assuage the greatest number of constituents possible) and continue to try to create the false impression that government is always ncessary and always good. All this has created, on top of our taxes for annual expenses, an additional tax burden to be borne to the tune of $30,560.00 per household.
In his closing paragraph Terry wrote in part, “Many failed government programs are the result of politicians compromising (to assuage the greatest number of constituents possible) and continue to try to create the false impression that government is always necessary and always good.”
I'm not a Tea Party fan either because I don't really agree with what they stand for (albeit they do raise good points). However, to call them a failure is inaccurate. The Tea Party, to the disdain of most of the country, really came out as one of the victors in this whole debt ceiling debate. A minority of idealists were able to impose their will on the entire Republican caucus. Boehner was nearly powerless.
John is absolutely right. Across the board cuts are needed, but nobody wants to see their favorite programs go. I'm not as invested in social security benefits as I'm sure many of you are, while many of you are not as interested in retaining federal aid programs for those in college.
Conor, how does the word "victor" fit? They created a fake crisis to supposedly cut the budget deep and put the country on the right track. What they achieved was nothing but, fake cuts and more of the same crap politics. In fact, they managed to mortally wound themselves, now only 14% of the public believes Congress has a clue.
Charlie, I think it was Boehner, middle of the road Republicans and Democrats in the House that passed the fake cuts. Most of the Tea Party members and hard core liberals voted against the deal.
John, I see lots of freshman on that list and if like Conor says the Republicans were powerless against the Tea Party, they sure did eat every bite of that Satan sandwich.
Regardless, it's pretty easy to determine the Tea Party was the BIG loser. They proved to be naïve, ineffectual and more of the same old tired politicians so, fixated with getting reelected they couldn't make the big boy deal.
The Daily Show - Dealageddon!
<div style="background-color:#000000;width:520px;"><div style="padding:4px;"><embed src="http://media.mtvnservices.com/mgid:cms:video:thedailyshow.com:393593&qu…; width="512" height="288" type="application/x-shockwave-flash" allowFullScreen="true" allowScriptAccess="always" base="." flashVars=""></embed><p style="text-align:left;background-color:#FFFFFF;padding:4px;margin-top:4px;margin-bottom:0px;font-family:Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;font-size:12px;"><b><a href="http://www.thedailyshow.com/watch/mon-august-1-2011/dealageddon----angr… Daily Show - Dealageddon! - Angry Tea Party</a></b><br/>Get More: <a href='http://www.thedailyshow.com/full-episodes/'>Daily Show Full Episodes</a>,<a href='http://www.indecisionforever.com/'>Political Humor & Satire Blog</a>,<a href='http://www.facebook.com/thedailyshow'>The Daily Show on Facebook</a></p></div></div>
Anyone unwilling to
Anyone unwilling to compromise for the betterment of our country is a problem, in my humble opinion.
Well, I've always thought
Well, I've always thought Alice was a bit naive, but then she's a child. The rabbit is too frantic, the dormouse is boring and the Hatter is well......Mad. The cat's OK
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Jason, what was is that the
Jason, what was is that the tea party wouldn't compromise on that was for the betterment of our county.
http://www.thehopeforamerica.
http://www.thehopeforamerica.com/play.php?id=8662
I agree with Sen. Marco Rubio
I agree with Sen. Marco Rubio from Florida "Rubio criticised the caucus, saying "My fear has always been that if you start creating these little clubs or organizations in Washington run by politicians, the movement starts to lose its energy."
slightly off subject, but
slightly off subject, but somewhat relevant from Rep. Dr. Ron Paul (Non-tea party caucus member) The Truth
http://thehill.com/blogs/congress-blog/economy-a-budget/174717-when-a-c…
For those saying that Tea
For those saying that Tea Party people are extremists out to destroy the nation, I ask - Do you honestly believe that Obama/Pelosi/Reid are acting in YOUR best interest?
Have we been so indoctrinated by the progressives that bigger government is the answer for all that ails us?
Have you totally discounted the Constitution? It clearly spells out the role of the federal government - which is nothing like what we have now. If socialization of a society holds such promise, how come it has never worked for the betterment of a people? Ever?
Are you so afraid of hard work, supporting yourself and your family that you welcome all the safety nets liberalism provides at such high a cost? A cost that has driven us to the brink of disaster?
Don't get me wrong - the republicans in office are almost as bad. I'm mad as hellat all of them.
[video:http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WINDtlPXmmE]
The Tea Party Congressional
The Tea Party Congressional Caucus are not extremists. They're party puritans and political hacks.
The debt ceiling debate wasn't about cutting spending as Paul says, it was about whose version of status quo gets protected.
Well said Howard. Status
Well said Howard.
Status quo= every household in this country carries a $30560.00 federal tax liability this year. If at the end of the year you haven't paid that much in taxes, you're just another middle class welfare recipient living off other peoples money.
Posted by terry paine on
Posted by terry paine on August 2, 2011 - 11:17am
Jason, what was is that the tea party wouldn't compromise on that was for the betterment of our county.
-I said nothing about the Tea Party. I was commenting on the far right's refusal to negotiate any tax increases, and the far left's refusal to cut spending on entitlements.
For weeks and weeks neither side was willing to compromise in the least. That's a problem. The two-party system is designed for both sides to be heard and to work together to come to compromise.
My mistake, I thought we
My mistake, I thought we where supposed to vote for a person to represent us and our ideals.
There was not so called tea
There was not so called tea party a few year ago..The liberals all called them names and wrote them off as nothing to worry about..the tea party is not made of off a bunch of rich people just a bunch of people who are sick and tired of the way both parties spend money..
who future are the protecting if not that of America..How are you spose to compromise on ones values...They believe in spending less and not adding to the huge debt we are all creating..Whats so wrong with cut cap and balance..Balance budget works in alot of states..Problem is 50% don't pay any federal taxes and they get most of the benefits..lets look at that..Flat Tax should be next on the tea party agenda..The tea party wants to cut out loops hole and exemptions for all..If you don't pay federal tax then you should not be getting money back at the end of the year...
Posted by terry paine on
Posted by terry paine on August 2, 2011 - 1:07pm
My mistake, I thought we where supposed to vote for a person to represent us and our ideals.
-Do you think your sarcasm drives your points home? You're missing the point. I also never said don't vote for someone that represents your ideals.
Are you so narrowminded to think that your ideals should be forced on others? If the answer is yes, then I have nothing for you.
If your answer is no, then you MUST understand that compromise is necessary.
[Patiently waits for you to say something else that's totally irrelevant]
Mark, don't confuse the
Mark, don't confuse the grassroots tea party with the gop tea party.
Howard i am not...i am
Howard i am not...i am talking about the grassroots party..they made this spending an issue and the ones they elected responsed with making a stand on this debt ceiling issue...Just as Obama did when he was in Congress..Why doesn't the left take a stand and call him a terrorist for standing for what he believed in at that time.
Nobody during the elections
Nobody during the elections that swept these Tea Party GOPers into power were talking about the debt ceiling, Mark. There was no call to "make a stand on the debt ceiling." It was a non-issue.
What was an issue was reducing spending.
That's not what we got from the TeaGOP. What we got was a lot of hot hair about reducing spending. We got a lie about how this deal will reduce spending. It actually increases spending, just not as fast as some imaginary projection dreamed up by bureaucrats.
If the TeaGOP was serious about reducing spending, they would be insisting on bringing all the troops home from overseas theaters, they would be talking about eliminating unneeded federal departments like the department of education, they would be talking about going to a flat or consumption tax and eliminating the IRS as we know it, they would be working on a serious plan to reduce medical expenses -- but they're not doing any of these things because they're hard and unpopular, no matter how necessary.
The TeaGOP doesn't give rat's ass about the American people, nor are they extremists. They exist as an arm of the GOP merely to fool gullible voters into protecting the perks and the power of the GOP and the cronies to donate to their campaigns.
We saw proof of that in our own backyard when the TeaGOP backed a party hack and loyalist like Jane Corwin for Congress rather than a grassroots Tea guy like David Bellavia.
Like them or not, no effort
Like them or not, no effort to try and cut spending would have taken place if the Tea party did not hols up the increase in the debt ceiling. That's been proven budget after budget.
Let's see now if the credit agencies still downgrade us since the "cuts" just made are really token cuts and over a ten year period.
John, the banks could care
John, the banks could care less what the Fed spends money on- as long as it spends money. Without the debt ceiling being raised, the banks wouldn't profit from more loans to the Fed. As for ending the wars: haven't you heard? The U. S. doesn't make washing machines anymore. The U. S. manufactures weaponry and munitions. No war- no profits.
Apparently these two points got missed somewhere along the line.
Seems to me that the Tea
Seems to me that the Tea types left major cuts on the table because they were too busy being politicians to deal. They were more concerned with their pledges to special interest groups to make the wholesale changes that were needed. The deal was a joke that cut almost nothing and the Tea Party is worthless.
Charlie, Again, if it was not
Charlie,
Again, if it was not for them, even the token cuts passed by moderates would not have been made. And most Tea Party members did not vote for this deal (neither did the hard core liberals). Next election I bet you see more hard core winners from both the right and left.
John, I hope we see more
John, I hope we see more independents or at least representatives of other parties. Because that'll show that Americans are fed up with partisan politics. Thanking the tea partiers for this deal is like having your leg cut off and saying, it could be worse, I could have had both cut off. Sure it's less worse, but I won't thank them for leaving me on 1 leg.
Dave I couldn't agree
Dave I couldn't agree more.
Having more of either extreme would be the biggest waste ever. The Tea Party, whom I know a few of their following, are not bad people. They came about out of anger of decades of goverment stupidity, which is fine. What they became though is nothing more than an extension of the GOP.
The national GOP took ahold of them and now they are useless. Did they bring about change? No. Did they bring about discussion? Sure. Did their "Our way or the highway" rhetoric work? No, it created an atrocious mess.
I will not "credit" them for progress for that.
The GOP establishment got
The GOP establishment got what it wanted with their T-Party....no return of of the tax rates that help create 23,000,000 jobs during the Clinton administration....let's all celebrate the big GOP/T-Party win...
John, all this has proven is
John, all this has proven is that hard core members get nothing accomplished. They simply are unable to compromise enough to make the tough decisions that are needed. The Tea Party is a failure and anyone who accepts that monicker is a nonstarter for one of my votes.
The idea that they left cuts on the table is disgraceful.
Charlie, like you have said,
Charlie, like you have said, everyone wants cuts, just not to their favorite program or handout. They did not have the votes to make the cuts needed.
John, I think we can agree on
John, I think we can agree on that, no one is willing to accept the changes that are really needed. We need to cut everything and raise taxes on everyone. Until there are enough people willing to do that, none of this debate really matters. The death spiral will continue.
Vice President Joseph
Vice President Joseph Robinette Biden Junior joined House Democrats in lashing tea party Republicans Monday, accusing them of having “acted like terrorists” in the fight over raising the nation’s debt limit.
Obviously number two didn’t get the memo from Obama’s teleprompter about the need for civil discourse.
Jason, I'd like to apologize
Jason, I'd like to apologize for the sarcasm (it s a horrible habit I'm trying to break).
I overlooked in your first post references to the far wings of both parties, not just the tea party.
But do I think that my ideals should be forced upon someone? Yes, I'd like my idea of the government not forcing anyone to do anything to be forced upon everyone.
Is compromise necessary? Well, can something be necessary and not realistic? Let's see. The person I would want to represent me would not want to drop 124 scud missiles in Libya. So tell me, what would a compromise look like in that instance? Would it be to only drop 62 missiles?
Many failed government programs are the result of politicians compromising (to assuage the greatest number of constituents possible) and continue to try to create the false impression that government is always ncessary and always good. All this has created, on top of our taxes for annual expenses, an additional tax burden to be borne to the tune of $30,560.00 per household.
In his closing paragraph
In his closing paragraph Terry wrote in part, “Many failed government programs are the result of politicians compromising (to assuage the greatest number of constituents possible) and continue to try to create the false impression that government is always necessary and always good.”
Well said Terry.
I'm not a Tea Party fan
I'm not a Tea Party fan either because I don't really agree with what they stand for (albeit they do raise good points). However, to call them a failure is inaccurate. The Tea Party, to the disdain of most of the country, really came out as one of the victors in this whole debt ceiling debate. A minority of idealists were able to impose their will on the entire Republican caucus. Boehner was nearly powerless.
John is absolutely right. Across the board cuts are needed, but nobody wants to see their favorite programs go. I'm not as invested in social security benefits as I'm sure many of you are, while many of you are not as interested in retaining federal aid programs for those in college.
In other words,...told ya's
In other words,...told ya's so
http://www.lp.org/news/press-releases/libertarians-predicted-tea-party-…
Conor, how does the word
Conor, how does the word "victor" fit? They created a fake crisis to supposedly cut the budget deep and put the country on the right track. What they achieved was nothing but, fake cuts and more of the same crap politics. In fact, they managed to mortally wound themselves, now only 14% of the public believes Congress has a clue.
http://www.realclearpolitics.com/epolls/other/congressional_job_approva…
The teapartyA$$holes are
The teapartyA$$holes are great at saying no, but they have NO IDEA how to govern.
Charlie, I think it was
Charlie, I think it was Boehner, middle of the road Republicans and Democrats in the House that passed the fake cuts. Most of the Tea Party members and hard core liberals voted against the deal.
John, I see lots of freshman
John, I see lots of freshman on that list and if like Conor says the Republicans were powerless against the Tea Party, they sure did eat every bite of that Satan sandwich.
http://clerk.house.gov/evs/2011/roll690.xml
Regardless, it's pretty easy to determine the Tea Party was the BIG loser. They proved to be naïve, ineffectual and more of the same old tired politicians so, fixated with getting reelected they couldn't make the big boy deal.
Erskine Bowles (next Treasury
Erskine Bowles (next Treasury Sec.?) said today "How can there be a winner and a loser when we didn't get to the finish line?"
http://content.usatoday.com/communities/theoval/post/2011/08/obama-gop-…