All those who 'Make a Mess" should clean it up. That means all adults, not just renters. All walks of life, need to put their big girl, and boy pants on, and do it!
It seems reasonable for a landlord to collect an additional deposit with a signed contract clearly stating the tenant will lose that deposit if the landlord is cited for even one tenant code violation. Currently the landlord has everything to lose and the tenant has nothing to lose. Give them something to lose.That's the only way to modify behavior. Even better is to add $10 to the deposit amount for every month they are a good tenant. That way they have more and more to lose. If they follow through they get their deposit back plus whatever has accumulated by being good renters. The deposit by itself would likely limit the riff raff. You know, those people who sit on the bench outside of the Pok-A-Dot. ;)
I'm not sure that NYS law would accommodate an incentive plan on security deposits. A landlord may use the security deposit as reimbursement for the reasonable cost of repairs beyond normal wear and tear or as reimbursement for any unpaid rent. ...Nothing about investing in good behavior.
Aside from the pettiness of the code (putting trash out on wrong day?)- are there no warnings?
While employed at GCC in the 70s, prior to construction of dorms, I coordinated Student Housing. College students remain a rental class of their own! Part of my job was to mediate landlord/tenant disputes. At the heart of every dispute was failure to communicate intent. (This includes landlords looking for sexual favors, those with a mission to save souls or penchants for testing the bounds of physical space.)
When landlords conducted background checks and personal interviews, checklist-walk throughs, reviewed/posted their expectations on tenant behavior and detailed the penalties for failure, incidences of problems were low.
A landlord would have to be a pretty poor judge of character (spelled: in the wrong business) to sign a lease with apartment trashers.
Pretty good points CM Barons however this is not the 70's anymore. Todays students are much more wise to the ways of the world, they know at most they will be in an apartment for 2 to 4 years. They know what the landlord can and cant do because of the internet and other resources available to them. And id security makes all but the most expensive background checks useless as they "protect" peoples privacy.
Yes as you pointed out there are some landlords who do the reprehnsible thing you described but then again those types of people are usually the exception not the standard.
You can put details into a lease to your hearts content, but without Judges actually listening and knowing the situation with tenants beyond that they are people paying a property owner for the right to live in his property, every single rule, expectation can be nullified as not legal unless there is a specific law allowing a landlord to enforce such.
This is the beginning of an issue that needs much more attention than this particular council is willing to give it, it will get much worse.
This town needs a landlords association to help mitigate these issues before they snowball into problems no one will be able to deal with in the future
C.M.,
I have a friend who is an attorney for one of the largest rental property owners in the Buffalo area.
I just asked him how they handle some of these problems. He puts it in the lease!
Examples: Garbage day is in covered in the lease. What day it is, when it can go out and when things have to be put back and where.
The lease states that if the landlord is fined due to something the renter did, the fine is either added to the next months rent or the fine amount must be paid to the landlord by a certain time and date. And if not paid on time, a 30 day notice is then given (that is also in the lease).
The landlord my friend works for had a lot of trouble in the Lincoln Park area of the Town of Tonwanda and their code enforcement makes ours look pathetic.
Since putting this type of language into the leases, in detail, the number of citations given the landlord has dropped.
I asked what were the most common problems and it was trash and unlicensed vehicles and cars parked on the front lawns.
Since the 30 day notice is written into the lease, he said they have no problem with evictions.
Again large property owners have much more ability to absorb the costs, especially if they are organized into an llc as they get tax breaks for vacant apts, not so with smaller landlords.
And also giving 30 day notice doesnt mean they are out in 30 days, it meant they have to show up in court, answer for what is going on then plead their case, then the judge if he makes a decision that day can rule or they set a date for another court hearing, and as pointed out if they have paid their rent in a timely manner it can be difficult.
Just because something is in a lease doesnt mean you can implement it. For instance, we had a lease that did not allow the use of nails or thumbtacks for hanging anything on the walls.... If they did repairs, (ie patch the hole and repainting the wall) would be deducted from the deposit. Well they fought it and guess what? even though clearly stated in lease normal wear and tear allows tenants in NYS to put pictures up w nails and screws anyway.
Another issue... You have a student rental, lease says no parties, and specifically states a party that would be a violation consisting of more than 2 guests per tenant, alcohol present and noise that disturbs residents outside the unit or violates local noise ordinances. Guess what, when they violate this with a party of 80 people or so, call the police they will have them quiet down, take the police report to court and try to evict them...judge will say they have right to enjoy premises free of hassle and you cannot regulate activities within the dwelling/apt.
It a problem all over, no matter if code enforcement is lax or like nazi stormtroopers people will do what they want because they play this system like they do any other.
As pointed out if thrown out, they will find another place and do it all over again.
So what he goes through in buffalo really doesnt relate to here.
I rent, if I ever did something that violated and local codes I wouldn't shun my responsibility on them. Unlike my current landlord (omitting name for now) whom left a stinking piles of filth (sewage, and not the nice clear treated stuff) on the basement floor here after the basement flooded over and over again for a month before he did anything about getting it fixed and the mess cleaned up. All that with My son and pregnant girlfriend in the house.
100 year old sewage system broke, left the house stinking and flooded with sewage in the basement, a ton of complaints later and a call to the city resulted in a small collection of code violations. He had been notified of them over the last few years including one that cause the previous tenant whom is my mother to fall down the stairs that resulted in her getting her knee replaced but never did anything about them until the city stepped in.
Of course now that most of the stuff is fixed he thinks everything is fine and dandy.
Brian, you're right, this is the other side of the story and the reason for City Council's new enforcement policy. There are bad landlords out there and they deserve every bit of scrutiny they get.
When I was campaigning I met a family who's basement had been flooded for over a month. They had called their landlord to fix it and he did nothing. They then called the city to have an inspector come by but the inspector was a no-show. I'm not sure if they ever got any relief.
The City needs to do its due diligence. Blanket enforcement will not work in an area that is so subjective. If Council is serious about this new policy they need to be willing to do the work necessary to ensure fair treatment for landlords and tenants alike. I'm not sure that Council leadership understood that before pushing the decision in question. Judging by her statements after this story came out I'm convinced that Ms. Clattenburg is ready to dig in her heels and be belligerent about this matter.
I rent so that makes me a
I rent so that makes me a Tenant but if a Tenant makes the mess they should clean it.... Makes sense to me! So I voted for "Tenants"
All those who 'Make a Mess"
All those who 'Make a Mess" should clean it up. That means all adults, not just renters. All walks of life, need to put their big girl, and boy pants on, and do it!
It seems reasonable for a
It seems reasonable for a landlord to collect an additional deposit with a signed contract clearly stating the tenant will lose that deposit if the landlord is cited for even one tenant code violation. Currently the landlord has everything to lose and the tenant has nothing to lose. Give them something to lose.That's the only way to modify behavior. Even better is to add $10 to the deposit amount for every month they are a good tenant. That way they have more and more to lose. If they follow through they get their deposit back plus whatever has accumulated by being good renters. The deposit by itself would likely limit the riff raff. You know, those people who sit on the bench outside of the Pok-A-Dot. ;)
The tenant should be
The tenant should be accountable for code violations, but the landlord is ultimately responsible.
I'm not sure that NYS law
I'm not sure that NYS law would accommodate an incentive plan on security deposits. A landlord may use the security deposit as reimbursement for the reasonable cost of repairs beyond normal wear and tear or as reimbursement for any unpaid rent. ...Nothing about investing in good behavior.
Aside from the pettiness of the code (putting trash out on wrong day?)- are there no warnings?
While employed at GCC in the 70s, prior to construction of dorms, I coordinated Student Housing. College students remain a rental class of their own! Part of my job was to mediate landlord/tenant disputes. At the heart of every dispute was failure to communicate intent. (This includes landlords looking for sexual favors, those with a mission to save souls or penchants for testing the bounds of physical space.)
When landlords conducted background checks and personal interviews, checklist-walk throughs, reviewed/posted their expectations on tenant behavior and detailed the penalties for failure, incidences of problems were low.
A landlord would have to be a pretty poor judge of character (spelled: in the wrong business) to sign a lease with apartment trashers.
Pretty good points CM Barons
Pretty good points CM Barons however this is not the 70's anymore. Todays students are much more wise to the ways of the world, they know at most they will be in an apartment for 2 to 4 years. They know what the landlord can and cant do because of the internet and other resources available to them. And id security makes all but the most expensive background checks useless as they "protect" peoples privacy.
Yes as you pointed out there are some landlords who do the reprehnsible thing you described but then again those types of people are usually the exception not the standard.
You can put details into a lease to your hearts content, but without Judges actually listening and knowing the situation with tenants beyond that they are people paying a property owner for the right to live in his property, every single rule, expectation can be nullified as not legal unless there is a specific law allowing a landlord to enforce such.
This is the beginning of an issue that needs much more attention than this particular council is willing to give it, it will get much worse.
This town needs a landlords association to help mitigate these issues before they snowball into problems no one will be able to deal with in the future
C.M., I have a friend who is
C.M.,
I have a friend who is an attorney for one of the largest rental property owners in the Buffalo area.
I just asked him how they handle some of these problems. He puts it in the lease!
Examples: Garbage day is in covered in the lease. What day it is, when it can go out and when things have to be put back and where.
The lease states that if the landlord is fined due to something the renter did, the fine is either added to the next months rent or the fine amount must be paid to the landlord by a certain time and date. And if not paid on time, a 30 day notice is then given (that is also in the lease).
The landlord my friend works for had a lot of trouble in the Lincoln Park area of the Town of Tonwanda and their code enforcement makes ours look pathetic.
Since putting this type of language into the leases, in detail, the number of citations given the landlord has dropped.
I asked what were the most common problems and it was trash and unlicensed vehicles and cars parked on the front lawns.
Since the 30 day notice is written into the lease, he said they have no problem with evictions.
Again large property owners
Again large property owners have much more ability to absorb the costs, especially if they are organized into an llc as they get tax breaks for vacant apts, not so with smaller landlords.
And also giving 30 day notice doesnt mean they are out in 30 days, it meant they have to show up in court, answer for what is going on then plead their case, then the judge if he makes a decision that day can rule or they set a date for another court hearing, and as pointed out if they have paid their rent in a timely manner it can be difficult.
Just because something is in a lease doesnt mean you can implement it. For instance, we had a lease that did not allow the use of nails or thumbtacks for hanging anything on the walls.... If they did repairs, (ie patch the hole and repainting the wall) would be deducted from the deposit. Well they fought it and guess what? even though clearly stated in lease normal wear and tear allows tenants in NYS to put pictures up w nails and screws anyway.
Another issue... You have a student rental, lease says no parties, and specifically states a party that would be a violation consisting of more than 2 guests per tenant, alcohol present and noise that disturbs residents outside the unit or violates local noise ordinances. Guess what, when they violate this with a party of 80 people or so, call the police they will have them quiet down, take the police report to court and try to evict them...judge will say they have right to enjoy premises free of hassle and you cannot regulate activities within the dwelling/apt.
It a problem all over, no matter if code enforcement is lax or like nazi stormtroopers people will do what they want because they play this system like they do any other.
As pointed out if thrown out, they will find another place and do it all over again.
So what he goes through in buffalo really doesnt relate to here.
A little off subject,
A little off subject, but...
I rent, if I ever did something that violated and local codes I wouldn't shun my responsibility on them. Unlike my current landlord (omitting name for now) whom left a stinking piles of filth (sewage, and not the nice clear treated stuff) on the basement floor here after the basement flooded over and over again for a month before he did anything about getting it fixed and the mess cleaned up. All that with My son and pregnant girlfriend in the house.
100 year old sewage system broke, left the house stinking and flooded with sewage in the basement, a ton of complaints later and a call to the city resulted in a small collection of code violations. He had been notified of them over the last few years including one that cause the previous tenant whom is my mother to fall down the stairs that resulted in her getting her knee replaced but never did anything about them until the city stepped in.
Of course now that most of the stuff is fixed he thinks everything is fine and dandy.
Brian, you're right, this is
Brian, you're right, this is the other side of the story and the reason for City Council's new enforcement policy. There are bad landlords out there and they deserve every bit of scrutiny they get.
When I was campaigning I met a family who's basement had been flooded for over a month. They had called their landlord to fix it and he did nothing. They then called the city to have an inspector come by but the inspector was a no-show. I'm not sure if they ever got any relief.
The City needs to do its due diligence. Blanket enforcement will not work in an area that is so subjective. If Council is serious about this new policy they need to be willing to do the work necessary to ensure fair treatment for landlords and tenants alike. I'm not sure that Council leadership understood that before pushing the decision in question. Judging by her statements after this story came out I'm convinced that Ms. Clattenburg is ready to dig in her heels and be belligerent about this matter.