There are mistakes all over. Doctors, nurses, etc. are just human. Whether it be UMMC or any other facility, these things happen. It's important to get on top of it and to work something out to prevent unfortunate things from happening in the future. My family has always gotten good care at UMMC. The medical staff has always been good. Small town ... big city ... it happens. Sad, but true. Instead of beating up our hospital, why not work to improve our conditions? UMMC needs support, not bashing.
I will explain some experiences I have had at UMMC.
1) This was almost 10 years ago, they have indeed changed the ER since then but, I was 11 years old and had 104 temp and flu like symptoms could barely walk and pain in abdomen. I was there for almost 10 hours they still did not know what was wrong. While there was blood on sheets, and very poor cleaning if any done. My mother said I am taking her to Children's in Buffalo. Within minutes of being at Children's I had appendicitis it was something that simple. My heat rate dropped to almost NOTHING. If my mom had not made the decision to take me to children i would have not been here typing this today.
2) The "Moms Program" ran through UMMC to "help" pregnant women with finances. I was 19 when I was pregnant which was 1 year ago. The woman who was there was so rude to me. Not explaining how or exactly where I was suppose to fill certain stuff out, when i asked more than once, she said "Do you have a learning disability or something?". After that she proceed to ask and tell me in a very attitude tone. Crazy things about my unborn child! So rude that I called my mom to come there and she WITNESSED how she was talking to me I walked out of there and sat in the parking lots crying for almost 40 min until I tired to calm down and stop shaking because she told me that I would not be able to raise my son in a good place and home being this young and she didn't understand why i was not on birth control. I complained to UMMC. She was still working there after. I dont understand, working with especially pregnant woman and your opinions on young mothers are like that, you should not be working there. Another icing to the cake, I walked out of there and said I did not want anything to do with the service and she still turned my paper work into Medicaid and WIC so I had two cases and it messed EVERYTHING up!.
I do not have one thing to say that is good about UMMC except the Maternity Floor. Other wise I go out of town to ER and for surgery's.
I have nothing but great things to say about the Maternity wing and those who work there...the ER, I'm still about 50/50: I've been insulted and treated like an idiot by one, but also wonderfully by some others. Also having worked in an ER, I know how hard things can get doing that day in/ day out...so my respect to those who do a great job that most of us couldn't or wouldn't do.
It's probably important to at least consider that the hospital has been operating at full capacity for a few weeks now, and with more patients, you would expect more cases of C Diff.
I've never had anything other than positive experiences at UMMC.
I think it is hit or miss depending on who you got. When I had my second daughter, the nurses on the 4th floor were great. 3 1/2 years later (2009) it was a MUCH different experience. It was HORRIBLE. I had a l&d nurse berate me for having a baby 4 weeks early through induction and arguing and undermining my dr's diagnosis. I didn't even WANT to have an early baby or induce. My ob and peri had to talk me into it! Medications that were ordered by my ob were either not given or the nurses refused to give it. Vitals were missed for a whole day. Birth certificate paperwork wasn't given until I asked for it at discharge. So much more that I asked to leave a day early. They wouldn't let me because of what I had and that I needed to be under observation (yet the L&D nurse berated me for delivering early and said I didn't have that!). I was the only one on the floor that weekend!
I was so upset with the care that I got with my 3rd daughter that when I had to have surgery last November, I REFUSED to go back to the 4th floor (women's surgeries are admitted there and stay there for recovery). I went to the 2nd floor instead. I had WONDERFUL nurses there. One night nurse cared for me as if I were her own daughter.
ER is the same way. I can tell you of some horror stories but then wonderful stories too. It all depends on what nurse and what dr you get. I have had really good care there. Then I have had really horrible care too.
Here is my family experience at this over rated hospital after a member was admitted to the hospital through the er for facial collitus (sp) and M.r.s.a. was told they would be in the hospital for 11 days for I.V. meds for the infections. But after 4 days of treatment a woman from the financial office came down to the room and determined that there was no insurance and not eligible for medicaid and no credit card to pay with, there head nurse was in the room as rude as hell saying you can go home now.This after they said the antibiotics would take ten days to work but instead they released this person into the public with an infectious desease and look at the bottom of anything in the E.R. you will see blood and rust i work in an surgical center and our place would never look like this and they all act like there doing you a favor this place should be shut until this infection is cured.And see what they do when you ask them to wash there hands in front of you there wise and say we wear gloves we welcome this at the facility I work at......
My experiences with UMMC -- and Genesee Memorial Hospital before the name change -- have been entirely positive. My family and I have received competent, compassionate care there for nearly 35 years and feel very fortunate to have a facility like it in our small city.
I think Genesee Memorial/St. Jeromes past reputation was that the care was second, if not third rate. People even said in the past that they wouldn't go to either place, even if they were dying.
Any dealings that I have had at UMMC in the past couple years, especially since the name change, seems to have a new dedication to helping people in the community. I can only hope that this type of service continues.
I had an absolutely AWFUL experience at UMMC a couple summers ago. I came in with unbearable abdominal pain and the first doctor I saw there didn't seem to ask a lot of questions or really assess my situation at all. She gave me a prescription for an antidiarrheal pill thinking that it would sort things out in my intestines and help with the pain. I took it for a few days and the pain just kept getting worse. I came back in even worse pain and this time, of course without any testing, they assumed that I had some crazy intestinal virus that could end up spreading to the rest of the hospital so they quarantined me to a room for 5 days. I was not allowed to leave the room so I couldn't shower and I was forced to relieve myself in a bucket on a stand as a sort of makeshift toilet. I hated it, but I wanted to stay because they made me feel like I was going to fall over dead if I didn't. On day 5 they finally did some testing and realized I had Salmonella. Not only was I NOT a threat to the rest of the hospital, but the antidiarrheal medication that I was given stopped my system from passing stool which caused the Salmonella to sit and fester inside my body. So I started out with a misdiagnosis, felt like a prisoner for days, and ended up a lot sicker than I needed to be. And to top it all off, during my 5 day visit, I spent my time avoiding certain nurses because some of them would give me the craziest amount of attitude when I would ask them to empty my bucket. Not all of them were bad, I did enjoy some of them, but if you don't have compassion for your patients - you probably shouldn't be a nurse. I wish I had gone to another hospital.,,
I fail to see the end game in this. Posing a question like this following the article it was based on naturally brings out way more negativity than anything else. I don't believe that the 500+ people that voted no all had bad experiences, nor are they related to or close acquaintences with people who did, however they are moved by accounts they hear because the bad attracts far more attention then the good. I'm sure that UMMC has it's share of problems that it needs to address like any health facility and should not be excused from taking care of them. The simple truth is UMMC is our only hospital and place of employment for our family, friends, and neighbors (just as a note of disclosure, I do not have a relative or close acquaintence working at UMMC). Opening it up for this kind of undefendable accusation does nothing to improve care, bolster recruitment, or draw people to this community. Every story of miscare that is related in this forum cannot be defended by UMMC for obvious reasons. That is not to say there is not veracity to the claims, it just leaves one side unable to counter and as I have always said no matter how thin you slice your bread, there is always two sides to it. UMMC is a valuable community asset that has it's flaws just like every institution, but allowing it to be subjected to this can only serve to make our community a place to avoid, not one to be desired. Again, what is the end game here?
Jeff, I'm surprised you would take a "head in the sand" attitude.
I'm sure you don't have enough information, and I know I don't have enough information to know, that this is just some sort of routine, all-hospitals-go-through-it type of problem.
It concerns me that one of the first things I heard when I came to town was "don't stay at UMMC." I've never been sure if that is just a certain propensity by a segment of Batavia to complain about whatever they can complain about (seems it's a New Yorker thing), or there is a real problem there.
I did have eye surgery at UMMC and everything was perfect, but before the Geraces came forward I had heard personally from a few people stories that were bothersome. That said, I've had family members have the same or worse experience at other hospitals.
So, I don't know what to think.
I do know no problem is ever solved with a "head in the sand" attitude. To me, the best way to deal with a problem is head on and complete transparency.
You say UMMC is an indefensible position. I completely disagree. I can think there are few things UMMC could yet do and information they could provide.
If the UMMC board and executives are alert and responsible, they're paying attention to the comments being left here. We're hearing from responsible, respected members of the community providing disturbing stories. The hospital can either take your attitude -- nothing to see here, move along -- or they can take a closer look and decide if there is yet more they can do to improve. They may take the closer look and find there isn't really anything wrong and these are just one-off complaints. But the point is, burying one's heads in the sand is never the appropriate answer.
I'm proud that The Batavian has been able to provide a community forum to discuss these issues. It has always been our goal to be the place where these sort of issues can be weighed and discussed by the entire community, because open communication and dialogue, even about hard and sensitive topics, leads to stronger communities.
This is news. It might be uncomfortable news. And what makes this different today from the way a story like this might have been reported a few years back is the public input in the form of the comments in today's new media. Before the internet negative information was just transmitted person to person.
In my 52 year history, mostly spent in this county, my family has both good experiences and not so good experiences at UMMC. But we have good and not so good experiences at Strong, as well. In fact my husband had a very negative experience at Strong a few years back. The bottom line is we need our local hospital in our community but at the same time it shouldn't be exempt from scrutiny when it serves the public.
I have a physician friend that has told me over and over again that a patient and/or family member must advocate boldly on their own behalf. There are so many variables in healthcare.
I commend the Gerace's for coming out and addressing this to the media. They are good citizen's and their public complaints may have a very positive effect on controlling what could be a situation that the administration needs to pay more attention to -- which in turn keeps other patients safer. Maybe that strain of bacteria is aggressive and dangerous and the extra measures need to be taken to protect public health.
And we can't blame the news for reporting a story like this. To the contrary what if the media didn't report stories like this?
I cannot see a single sentence in Jeff's post that I disagree with. Howard you say he has his head in the sand. I disagree and I don't know if I even need to add anything beyond his words. There is always 2 sides and UMMC is not in a position to play this out in the media. I have worked several years in homecare and have heard negative experiences from many patients/families about every hospital in the 3 counties. When I went to the other UMMC- University of Maryland Medical Center to see my dad I had been in the room 5 minutes when a nurse came in and gave him a medication in a small cup, approximately 10ml to drink. Ten minutes later another nurse came in with another. As my dad reached for it I told him to wait and I said to the nurse,"What is that cuz it looks just like what the other nurse gave him." She took it and never came back. I then told my dad he needs to pay more attention to things. He said he thought the nurses know their job. I would say this to anyone. You are your last line of defense! Mistakes happen everywhere. I do not believe this media attention is warranted. I have not seen any reporting that proves any of these cases of C-diff were hospital acquired or that UMMC has more cases than any other hospital or that their procedures and protocol are any different than anywhere else. I sympathize with Jessica and Sabrina and their individual concerns with how they were treated by staff. Unfortunately there are nurses out there that have bad attitudes. I was in nursing school with some, even our instructor had to tell the class that some of them needed to rethink why they really wanted to be or even if they should be nurses! Lastly, Lorie says,"And we can't blame the news for reporting a story like this. To the contrary what if the media didn't report stories like this?" What is the story? There is only a one sided story. I have been treated at UMMC as have my children who were born there. We have always received exceptional care. I have never had a bad experience in the ER or fast track which has been a Godsend. Maybe the story should be more educational.
I was watching this post until I heard the "we might have to take legal action"....I am having a procedure next thursday.....if they kill me... I will join with the protesters!!!!!!!!
Howard,
First, I reject the head in the sand comment. I clearly stated in my post that UMMC should not be excused from wrongdoing if they are guilty. Second, you are correct that neither you nor I have enough information about the problem to make a judgement on it. That was the basis of my post, this is not the forum in which to bring resolve to the issue.
Media is a powerful tool and open debate is a great way of bringing all aspects into the light, however a hospital stands in a unique position of not being able to engage in open debate. When we debate politics on TheBatavian, the right, the left and even the candidates can directly address each issue at length. Each person who relates a story of miscare is able to do so freely and with as much information(as perceived from their perspective) as they want. The hospital because of health and privacy laws cannot respond leaving the reader with only one side of the story.
What you heard when you first came to Batavia about UMMC is a result of who you spoke to. If you had moved to Medina you would have heard people say "I wouldn't take my dog to Medina Hospital", you would have heard the same thing about Lakeside in Brockport, or any other community hospital. Human nature shows us constantly that negativity sells, gossip is juicy, and naysaying is is great way to change things. The truth is for every story of bad care received at UMMC there are 10 stories of a life saved, a crisis averted, a quick and successful treatment, a kind and compassionate experience. But we will never hear about them because you don't see news articles when hospitals go above and beyond.
You are from San Diego, a quick Google search showed at least 10 hospitals in a radius the size of Genesee County. In a situation like that competition can lead to better care. We don't have that luxury in Genesee County. UMMC is our only hospital. We have to rely on the protections and policies of regulations, Government healthcare oversight, and lastly litigation. One sided public forum debate in this situation will do nothing but harm UMMC's chances of making the neccessary changes to rectify these issues. I think we have made great strides of late. Having Mercy Flight and Mercy EMS set up shop here in our county has put us in a unique advantage of having the absolute fastest trauma response in the area. I would think that the quality of medical facilities played some role in Mercy choosing us. No business is going to attach itself to corrupt and mismanaged facility.
I will go back to my original question, what is the end game here? If UMMC is continually subjected to what amounts in some cases to slander, then we go back to the old adage that perception is reality. It opens up the real possibility that the end result is losing our only Hospital. Imagine a Genesee County without a hospital. Imagine having to go to Buffalo or Rochester for all emergencies, or any medical procedure large and small. Imagine two more empty buildings with little hope of filling them. Sure the Doctors and some of the nurses will move on to other hospitals, but what about the maintanence staff, the custodial staff, the food service staff, the office support. All friends, family, neighbors, and taxpayers looking for work in an area already hard pressed by our economy.
Does UMMC have issues it needs to deal with? I'm sure it does and it should. The original Gerace article may have started out a public service piece, but once opened up to public forum it became something very different. The follow-up poll question just took it to a whole new level, one that will have a lasting impact on the reputation of not just UMMC but our whole area as we strive to build our community.
Jeff, your argument against an open forum on this topic is very much "head in the sand." Characterize it all you want any other way, but in the end, that's what it is. All you wrote above merely reinforces that conclusion.
This is the perfect forum to have an open discussion about the topic, because it's the only place the whole community can come together -- including UMMC should they choose to participate -- to discuss the issue.
This has not been a one-sided debate as you state. Several people have come on to defend UMMC and point out there own positive experiences and belief in the hospital.
While the hospital may not be able to respond to individual cases, there are plenty of other ways they can respond and bring information to light. They are not without recourse, as you seem to think.
We have nothing to apologize for here, Jeff. We are not in the business of hiding information from the public nor in stifling public debate.
Michele, how can you say the story was one sided. We quoted Mark Schoell at length. You also say it should be more educational -- we provided a good deal of information on C diff and its occurrences. Further, this is an open forum. If UMMC would like to provide more information, they are certainly welcome to do so. Your accusation of one-sidedness is completely without foundation.
If it had not been for WBTA and the Batavian, we would not have know there even was a problem. Don't know about the majority here, but I had not heard of C diff before this and will be more aware of it in the future. Good going Howard!
Jeff I just wanted to make a point. Anything said here is not and could not be prosecuted as "Slander" look at this legal definition...
Slander is the spoken or transitory form of defamation of character, a legal term that refers to a falsehood presented as true which could harm the reputation of a person or entity.
Now if we meditate on that we might be able to come to some conclusions. 1) If ummc wants to persue slander(actually it would be libel as this is a form of print media) They would have to prove these statements people are making are false, if it turns out they cant prove them false then what....
Then as far as c-diff and how they handle this and other rampant infections, they would have to show that they PRACTICE regularly the procedures to prevent them...not just have them in place.
Thirdly you dont think that NYS Health Dept would begin to scrutinize this hospital if it started prosecuting for libel, people who communicate a bad experience? Especially if it turns out that such complaints have some credibility.
As Howard pointed out they have the ability to respond, and are aware of what is or isnt being said about them. I prefer to be informed myself and if you look around the hospital and emergency room you'll see signs that ARE posted telling people to S.P.E.A.K. cant remember what the acronym's letters stand for but a couple of them were urgings to question and be Very Vocal and involved in your treatment while at the facility.
Howard,
you have done what an owner of a news publication is suppossed to do. You broke a story, you gotten over 1300 responses to a poll, you engaged people in debate, and you have generated interest in TheBatavian. In that sense the poll was a success. I however am looking at it from the standpoint of what it may leave in it's wake. I am a lifelong resident of Genesee County, I was born at then Genesee Memorial Hospital, I and my family have had countless positive experiences at Genesee Memorial, St. Jerome, and now UMMC. We once had two hospitals in Genesee County, now we have one, and if this is how we as a community seek to solve the issues at UMMC, we will have NO hospital in Genesee County.
What has been accomplished in this exercise is less people in the area having confidence in our hospital. That equates to people and businesses looking to relocate to our community perhaps second guessing it.
I know we disagree on this but I truly believe in this case that a disservice has been done, not a public service. I said it before, perception is reality and words are like bullets, once you fire them, you can't take them back. Many people will read the posts here and the sad reality is that they will only take away the negative, it is human nature. Without the whole story, they are left with a skewed perception of the hospital. You say that UMMC is free to defend itself and you also know that they would be legally limited to generalities and education pieces while all the accounts of miscare will be left unchecked. I don't discount the experiences of the Geraces, Kyle, C.M.,Scott, Amy, Sabrina, Laura, and Jessica, but the truth is the perceptions of people in their sphere of influence as well as countless others are now driven by their accounts. Any limited, non-specific, educational response that UMMC would be able to put out cannot counter the story of a sick person alleging mistreatment in a hospital.
Jeff you are forgetting a few things tho..... Words are not like bullets, people can take back what they say or excuse it to high passion of the moment etc. Also I cant believe that if the experiences of a few people like the ones who have posted here are publicly aired. UMMC might not be able to or be limited in their response to the public, but they ARE administrators and as such can take action on the incidents themselves like demotions or removing personnel that constantly get valid complaints. Require mandatory training meetings, and change policies regarding these types of infractions within their own org.
So please dont exaggerate the helplessness of UMMC to much. As Howard said take your head out of the sand and stop painting UMMC and Us with a very generalized paintbrush filled with assumptions. Just so you can justify your opinion, your entitled to it but opinions arent facts so they dont have to be correct. Your just not gonna convince anyone that yours is the right one and everyone elses needs to be questioned.
Kyle, when you said "but they ARE administrators and as such can take action on the incidents themselves like demotions or removing personnel that constantly get valid complaints. Require mandatory training meetings, and change policies regarding these types of infractions within their own org." you hit the nail on the head. My whole point in this has been just that. Policies exist not only at the local level, but at the state and federal level that serve as oversight and correction for these issues. If the hospital's actual track record were indicative of the poll and responses, then how on earth is it still even open? Unless someone is willing to assert that UMMC is paying off investigators not to follow up on claims, then enforcement of policy is the avenue to rectify them, not putting UMMC into the court of public opinion. I stand by the assertion that the poll and subsequent debate are a disservice rather than a means to a solution in this situation. I see nothing gained in further erdoing their reputation.
Jeff, you forgot that I live in Genesee County, too and have as much a stake in the hospital as you do. While you try to slime me by attributing ulterior business motives, certainly not not unaware of the negative impacts you mention. It certainly wouldn't be in my best business interest for UMMC to go under (as you seem to think possible).
I believe always and forever that transparency and open and honest dialogue is a public service.
"Sunlight is the best disinfectant," Justice Louis Brandeis.
I also stated I think it is who you get. I have had both experiences there good and bad. The experience that I had when I had my second daughter was wonderful. I even wrote a letter to UMMC and the Daily News about it in 2005. However, the experience I had with my 3rd daughter was born was HORRIBLE in 2009 with the nursing care. I wrote a letter to the Hospital Administrator and the nurse manager. I got a basic form letter back saying sorry for your experience if it really happened (at least that is the way I took it). It wasn't acknowleged. It wasn't stated that we will look into this and correct it. There were several nurses that CLEARLY overstepped their scope of work. I pulled my medical records because I had nurses telling me my dr didn't order x, y, and z. Ex. I asked for motrin. The nurse told me my dr didn't order it. Not only had he ordered it, he had ordered up to 10mg lortab for pain (I didn't need lortab, it was there if I had). I actually had to send my husband to the store to buy motrin and bring it back to the hospital for me to take. Motrin is a standard medicine for cramping after birth. For one medicine which I WATCHED him write the order for, I had several nurses tell me it wasn't ordered, they were uncomfortable giving it to me because I had a codeine allergy (I took the one WITHOUT codeine - there were two forms, and several other excuses. I had watched him write the order and had to tell them to go look in my chart, it was there. In November 2010, I was back for surgery and admitted for 3 days. I had absolutely wonderful care with the second floor nurses. I didn't have to ask if this med was ordered or not. The nurses automatically came in and asked me if I needed it or wanted it. They were great on the second floor. We ran into a unique situation where both my husband and I were hospitalized the same day. They communicated what was going on with both of us and took excellent care of both of us. I will say that one thing that was different was that in 2010, a nurse manager popped into my room at some point, introduced himself, and asked me if I had any concerns or issues. Maybe that is making a difference. No one is saying that they want the hospital to close down. What people are saying is there are some issues. They need to be brought up. They need to be dealt with. Would I go back to the 4th floor again? No. Those days are over with for me. Would I go back to UMMC again? Yes. Will I speak up and ask for a patient advocate if I think I am not getting the right care or a nurse and I don't click? yes. You have to be an advocate for yourself. Probably what I should have done back in 2009 was ask for a different l&d nurse. There are things to be done on both sides of the coin.
Jeff.... policies may exsist of that I have no doubt. But again either because of apathy or the feeling they do enough some dont always get implemented. There is now evidence that this is happening.
As for State and Federal regualtory agencies, your kidding right? These agencies are so overwhelmed with beaurocratic nonsense and too much work that unless a very large and significant portion of our community either fell sick or complained then they would do no moare than a cursory look into things, no bribes or influence is needed just showing UMMC can just take care of immediate concerns and stay open.
No matter how you look at it there is nothing wrong with people airing their opinions and anyone that takes offense to such things especially with a community resource like this makes themselves look like an oddball.
Perception is not reality, that way of thinking really puts you in danger as reality is reality and it will bite.....hard if your not careful.
Jeff, if UMMC was receptive to criticism and demonstrated a 'good faith' effort to address outside concerns, this forum would have projected a more positive portrait of the hospital. Instead, hospital management is defensive (like you). I went the grievance route, making use of the hospital's internal process for resolution. It was a waste of time; like presenting an opposing viewpoint to Tom Reynolds when he was chief fundraiser for the GOP (WNY congressman)- an exercise in futility.
If UMMC wants to earn the title of community hospital, it better stop relying on the boardroom for direction and take the pulse of the people who it serves.
The medical establishment is long overdue for shedding its wall of arrogance.
...That's me, John- pathetic. ...Just like the politics and greed that drives healthcare policy in this country. How much money did Reynolds funnel from the healthcare industry to GOP coffers? ...Yeah- unrelated! Just like GOP defunding of federal meat inspectors has nothing to do with tainted meat...
"If it had not been for WBTA and the Batavian, we would not have know there even was a problem."
That's not true. The story was in the Rochester news on 04/16.
Also, for everyone piling on UMMC, try finding any hospital that isn't having issues with this much larger problem.
"Hospital-acquired infections strike an estimated 19,528 Upstate New Yorkers each year, killing 976 of them and adding $157.4 million to regional health care costs, according to estimates by Excellus BlueCross BlueShield."
"If it had not been for WBTA and the Batavian, we would not have know there even was a problem."
That's not true. The story was in the Rochester news on 04/16.
Also, for everyone piling on UMMC, try finding any hospital that isn't having issues with this much larger problem.
"Hospital-acquired infections strike an estimated 19,528 Upstate New Yorkers each year, killing 976 of them and adding $157.4 million to regional health care costs, according to estimates by Excellus BlueCross BlueShield."
Howard, how was I wrong in pointing out what a news publication does and how you accomplished it. You are a business owner and your job is to make the business successful. In the news industry that means breaking stories, engaging the public in debate, generating interest in your publication, and selling advertising. You can say that your only motive is to bring truth and accountability to your readers, but the bottom line, as in any business, is to support yourself and your family. There is nothing innoble in that, it is the news business.
Just to put this to rest and get things straight, when people come on this sight and call a local institution "awful" and "horrible" with the institution having no opportunity to directly answer the claim, that is called open and honest dialogue and a public service. When I present my opinion without one deragotory word that I don't think this was the proper forum for the debate, I am "sliming".
Jeff, I said you were sliming by implying, if not outright stating, that my motives are entirely impure, not that you were engaging in debate.
And you continue down that path.
There's no doubt I have a profit motive in running the site, but that's not the only motive and your attempt to paint my position as purely motivated by profit is both wrong and insulting.
And again, Mark Schoell is welcome to register for an account and defend UMMC any time he wants. He can leave whatever comments he likes in defense of UMMC. Your statement that UMMC is without defense is both factually and logically wrong. If UMMC chooses not to engage in a discussion with the community, that's on them, not on The Batavian. There is plenty they could say that does not violate any law or ethical guideline. Your pretense to the opposite simply isn't true.
Howard,
I stated 4 motivations in my posts:
1.breaking stories - your quote:
"We are not in the business of hiding information from the public"
2.engaging the public in debate - your quote:
"I believe always and forever that transparency and open and honest dialogue is a public service."
3.generating interest in your publication - that is your obligation to advertisers.
4.selling advertising - your quote:
"There's no doubt I have a profit motive in running the site"
I also stated earlier that none of your motivations are innoble, they are simply the news business. I don't see where I outright stated or even implied impure motive, I simply stated you were doing your job and that I happened to disagree with how you did it by posing the poll question. If you feel slimed, wronged, or insulted then I apologive that it was taken that way. But I stand behind my assertions that this whole exercise has only eroded confidence in our local healthcare system and that benefits no one.
Howard, Thank you for the coverage its an important story that has been made accessible to the public thanks to this forum.I think we should ask another question and just for the heck of it lets exclude people that are associated in any way with UMMC and see the responses to your the questions asked.I didn't try and slam this hospital in my view just told of a family experience.But I may have been unfair in not saying that I also think this hospital on the whole has very helpful people working there.There gonna be in tip top shape after all this but to keep them there I think they should do mock drills to keep them all tip top I would start with this simple step if you mop a room don't use that same water to mop another room or to mop the hallway this seems like a simple step to take to help reduce the spread of germs but you can see this done there all the time.And install foot washers our feet are the dirtiest things there are look at all the feces and spit we walk through daily we spread it everywhere.
I think we should all keep something in mind when we assess all the negative comments and experiences that have been shared in this forum regarding the care UMMC provides...the majority of the population they serve are the elderly. The elderly are the fastest growing population in our country right now. How many elderly people do you know with computers or the internet for that matter? I'm sure there are some technology savvy seniors in our town, but not many. I have several friends who work at our hospital, and they frequently speak of the cards and chocolates, and free pizza dinners that patients and families provide for them on a regular basis. They are receiving praise for their outstanding care and compassion daily. My one friend stated this week that their entire bulletin board is filled with cards from discharged patients and their families thanking them for their positive experiences. When we make a generalized statement about the overall experience the hospital is providing our community, keep in mind that all of us on this online forum make up the hospital's minority group of costumers...the majority of patients they serve will never read these comments or have access to add to them.
There are mistakes all over.
There are mistakes all over. Doctors, nurses, etc. are just human. Whether it be UMMC or any other facility, these things happen. It's important to get on top of it and to work something out to prevent unfortunate things from happening in the future. My family has always gotten good care at UMMC. The medical staff has always been good. Small town ... big city ... it happens. Sad, but true. Instead of beating up our hospital, why not work to improve our conditions? UMMC needs support, not bashing.
I will explain some
I will explain some experiences I have had at UMMC.
1) This was almost 10 years ago, they have indeed changed the ER since then but, I was 11 years old and had 104 temp and flu like symptoms could barely walk and pain in abdomen. I was there for almost 10 hours they still did not know what was wrong. While there was blood on sheets, and very poor cleaning if any done. My mother said I am taking her to Children's in Buffalo. Within minutes of being at Children's I had appendicitis it was something that simple. My heat rate dropped to almost NOTHING. If my mom had not made the decision to take me to children i would have not been here typing this today.
2) The "Moms Program" ran through UMMC to "help" pregnant women with finances. I was 19 when I was pregnant which was 1 year ago. The woman who was there was so rude to me. Not explaining how or exactly where I was suppose to fill certain stuff out, when i asked more than once, she said "Do you have a learning disability or something?". After that she proceed to ask and tell me in a very attitude tone. Crazy things about my unborn child! So rude that I called my mom to come there and she WITNESSED how she was talking to me I walked out of there and sat in the parking lots crying for almost 40 min until I tired to calm down and stop shaking because she told me that I would not be able to raise my son in a good place and home being this young and she didn't understand why i was not on birth control. I complained to UMMC. She was still working there after. I dont understand, working with especially pregnant woman and your opinions on young mothers are like that, you should not be working there. Another icing to the cake, I walked out of there and said I did not want anything to do with the service and she still turned my paper work into Medicaid and WIC so I had two cases and it messed EVERYTHING up!.
I do not have one thing to say that is good about UMMC except the Maternity Floor. Other wise I go out of town to ER and for surgery's.
I have nothing but great
I have nothing but great things to say about the Maternity wing and those who work there...the ER, I'm still about 50/50: I've been insulted and treated like an idiot by one, but also wonderfully by some others. Also having worked in an ER, I know how hard things can get doing that day in/ day out...so my respect to those who do a great job that most of us couldn't or wouldn't do.
It's probably important to at
It's probably important to at least consider that the hospital has been operating at full capacity for a few weeks now, and with more patients, you would expect more cases of C Diff.
I've never had anything other than positive experiences at UMMC.
I think it is hit or miss
I think it is hit or miss depending on who you got. When I had my second daughter, the nurses on the 4th floor were great. 3 1/2 years later (2009) it was a MUCH different experience. It was HORRIBLE. I had a l&d nurse berate me for having a baby 4 weeks early through induction and arguing and undermining my dr's diagnosis. I didn't even WANT to have an early baby or induce. My ob and peri had to talk me into it! Medications that were ordered by my ob were either not given or the nurses refused to give it. Vitals were missed for a whole day. Birth certificate paperwork wasn't given until I asked for it at discharge. So much more that I asked to leave a day early. They wouldn't let me because of what I had and that I needed to be under observation (yet the L&D nurse berated me for delivering early and said I didn't have that!). I was the only one on the floor that weekend!
I was so upset with the care that I got with my 3rd daughter that when I had to have surgery last November, I REFUSED to go back to the 4th floor (women's surgeries are admitted there and stay there for recovery). I went to the 2nd floor instead. I had WONDERFUL nurses there. One night nurse cared for me as if I were her own daughter.
ER is the same way. I can tell you of some horror stories but then wonderful stories too. It all depends on what nurse and what dr you get. I have had really good care there. Then I have had really horrible care too.
Here is my family experience
Here is my family experience at this over rated hospital after a member was admitted to the hospital through the er for facial collitus (sp) and M.r.s.a. was told they would be in the hospital for 11 days for I.V. meds for the infections. But after 4 days of treatment a woman from the financial office came down to the room and determined that there was no insurance and not eligible for medicaid and no credit card to pay with, there head nurse was in the room as rude as hell saying you can go home now.This after they said the antibiotics would take ten days to work but instead they released this person into the public with an infectious desease and look at the bottom of anything in the E.R. you will see blood and rust i work in an surgical center and our place would never look like this and they all act like there doing you a favor this place should be shut until this infection is cured.And see what they do when you ask them to wash there hands in front of you there wise and say we wear gloves we welcome this at the facility I work at......
My experiences with UMMC --
My experiences with UMMC -- and Genesee Memorial Hospital before the name change -- have been entirely positive. My family and I have received competent, compassionate care there for nearly 35 years and feel very fortunate to have a facility like it in our small city.
I think Genesee Memorial/St.
I think Genesee Memorial/St. Jeromes past reputation was that the care was second, if not third rate. People even said in the past that they wouldn't go to either place, even if they were dying.
Any dealings that I have had at UMMC in the past couple years, especially since the name change, seems to have a new dedication to helping people in the community. I can only hope that this type of service continues.
I had an absolutely AWFUL
I had an absolutely AWFUL experience at UMMC a couple summers ago. I came in with unbearable abdominal pain and the first doctor I saw there didn't seem to ask a lot of questions or really assess my situation at all. She gave me a prescription for an antidiarrheal pill thinking that it would sort things out in my intestines and help with the pain. I took it for a few days and the pain just kept getting worse. I came back in even worse pain and this time, of course without any testing, they assumed that I had some crazy intestinal virus that could end up spreading to the rest of the hospital so they quarantined me to a room for 5 days. I was not allowed to leave the room so I couldn't shower and I was forced to relieve myself in a bucket on a stand as a sort of makeshift toilet. I hated it, but I wanted to stay because they made me feel like I was going to fall over dead if I didn't. On day 5 they finally did some testing and realized I had Salmonella. Not only was I NOT a threat to the rest of the hospital, but the antidiarrheal medication that I was given stopped my system from passing stool which caused the Salmonella to sit and fester inside my body. So I started out with a misdiagnosis, felt like a prisoner for days, and ended up a lot sicker than I needed to be. And to top it all off, during my 5 day visit, I spent my time avoiding certain nurses because some of them would give me the craziest amount of attitude when I would ask them to empty my bucket. Not all of them were bad, I did enjoy some of them, but if you don't have compassion for your patients - you probably shouldn't be a nurse. I wish I had gone to another hospital.,,
I fail to see the end game in
I fail to see the end game in this. Posing a question like this following the article it was based on naturally brings out way more negativity than anything else. I don't believe that the 500+ people that voted no all had bad experiences, nor are they related to or close acquaintences with people who did, however they are moved by accounts they hear because the bad attracts far more attention then the good. I'm sure that UMMC has it's share of problems that it needs to address like any health facility and should not be excused from taking care of them. The simple truth is UMMC is our only hospital and place of employment for our family, friends, and neighbors (just as a note of disclosure, I do not have a relative or close acquaintence working at UMMC). Opening it up for this kind of undefendable accusation does nothing to improve care, bolster recruitment, or draw people to this community. Every story of miscare that is related in this forum cannot be defended by UMMC for obvious reasons. That is not to say there is not veracity to the claims, it just leaves one side unable to counter and as I have always said no matter how thin you slice your bread, there is always two sides to it. UMMC is a valuable community asset that has it's flaws just like every institution, but allowing it to be subjected to this can only serve to make our community a place to avoid, not one to be desired. Again, what is the end game here?
Jeff, I'm surprised you would
Jeff, I'm surprised you would take a "head in the sand" attitude.
I'm sure you don't have enough information, and I know I don't have enough information to know, that this is just some sort of routine, all-hospitals-go-through-it type of problem.
It concerns me that one of the first things I heard when I came to town was "don't stay at UMMC." I've never been sure if that is just a certain propensity by a segment of Batavia to complain about whatever they can complain about (seems it's a New Yorker thing), or there is a real problem there.
I did have eye surgery at UMMC and everything was perfect, but before the Geraces came forward I had heard personally from a few people stories that were bothersome. That said, I've had family members have the same or worse experience at other hospitals.
So, I don't know what to think.
I do know no problem is ever solved with a "head in the sand" attitude. To me, the best way to deal with a problem is head on and complete transparency.
You say UMMC is an indefensible position. I completely disagree. I can think there are few things UMMC could yet do and information they could provide.
If the UMMC board and executives are alert and responsible, they're paying attention to the comments being left here. We're hearing from responsible, respected members of the community providing disturbing stories. The hospital can either take your attitude -- nothing to see here, move along -- or they can take a closer look and decide if there is yet more they can do to improve. They may take the closer look and find there isn't really anything wrong and these are just one-off complaints. But the point is, burying one's heads in the sand is never the appropriate answer.
I'm proud that The Batavian has been able to provide a community forum to discuss these issues. It has always been our goal to be the place where these sort of issues can be weighed and discussed by the entire community, because open communication and dialogue, even about hard and sensitive topics, leads to stronger communities.
This is news. It might be
This is news. It might be uncomfortable news. And what makes this different today from the way a story like this might have been reported a few years back is the public input in the form of the comments in today's new media. Before the internet negative information was just transmitted person to person.
In my 52 year history, mostly spent in this county, my family has both good experiences and not so good experiences at UMMC. But we have good and not so good experiences at Strong, as well. In fact my husband had a very negative experience at Strong a few years back. The bottom line is we need our local hospital in our community but at the same time it shouldn't be exempt from scrutiny when it serves the public.
I have a physician friend that has told me over and over again that a patient and/or family member must advocate boldly on their own behalf. There are so many variables in healthcare.
I commend the Gerace's for coming out and addressing this to the media. They are good citizen's and their public complaints may have a very positive effect on controlling what could be a situation that the administration needs to pay more attention to -- which in turn keeps other patients safer. Maybe that strain of bacteria is aggressive and dangerous and the extra measures need to be taken to protect public health.
And we can't blame the news for reporting a story like this. To the contrary what if the media didn't report stories like this?
I cannot see a single
I cannot see a single sentence in Jeff's post that I disagree with. Howard you say he has his head in the sand. I disagree and I don't know if I even need to add anything beyond his words. There is always 2 sides and UMMC is not in a position to play this out in the media. I have worked several years in homecare and have heard negative experiences from many patients/families about every hospital in the 3 counties. When I went to the other UMMC- University of Maryland Medical Center to see my dad I had been in the room 5 minutes when a nurse came in and gave him a medication in a small cup, approximately 10ml to drink. Ten minutes later another nurse came in with another. As my dad reached for it I told him to wait and I said to the nurse,"What is that cuz it looks just like what the other nurse gave him." She took it and never came back. I then told my dad he needs to pay more attention to things. He said he thought the nurses know their job. I would say this to anyone. You are your last line of defense! Mistakes happen everywhere. I do not believe this media attention is warranted. I have not seen any reporting that proves any of these cases of C-diff were hospital acquired or that UMMC has more cases than any other hospital or that their procedures and protocol are any different than anywhere else. I sympathize with Jessica and Sabrina and their individual concerns with how they were treated by staff. Unfortunately there are nurses out there that have bad attitudes. I was in nursing school with some, even our instructor had to tell the class that some of them needed to rethink why they really wanted to be or even if they should be nurses! Lastly, Lorie says,"And we can't blame the news for reporting a story like this. To the contrary what if the media didn't report stories like this?" What is the story? There is only a one sided story. I have been treated at UMMC as have my children who were born there. We have always received exceptional care. I have never had a bad experience in the ER or fast track which has been a Godsend. Maybe the story should be more educational.
I was watching this post
I was watching this post until I heard the "we might have to take legal action"....I am having a procedure next thursday.....if they kill me... I will join with the protesters!!!!!!!!
Howard, First, I reject the
Howard,
First, I reject the head in the sand comment. I clearly stated in my post that UMMC should not be excused from wrongdoing if they are guilty. Second, you are correct that neither you nor I have enough information about the problem to make a judgement on it. That was the basis of my post, this is not the forum in which to bring resolve to the issue.
Media is a powerful tool and open debate is a great way of bringing all aspects into the light, however a hospital stands in a unique position of not being able to engage in open debate. When we debate politics on TheBatavian, the right, the left and even the candidates can directly address each issue at length. Each person who relates a story of miscare is able to do so freely and with as much information(as perceived from their perspective) as they want. The hospital because of health and privacy laws cannot respond leaving the reader with only one side of the story.
What you heard when you first came to Batavia about UMMC is a result of who you spoke to. If you had moved to Medina you would have heard people say "I wouldn't take my dog to Medina Hospital", you would have heard the same thing about Lakeside in Brockport, or any other community hospital. Human nature shows us constantly that negativity sells, gossip is juicy, and naysaying is is great way to change things. The truth is for every story of bad care received at UMMC there are 10 stories of a life saved, a crisis averted, a quick and successful treatment, a kind and compassionate experience. But we will never hear about them because you don't see news articles when hospitals go above and beyond.
You are from San Diego, a quick Google search showed at least 10 hospitals in a radius the size of Genesee County. In a situation like that competition can lead to better care. We don't have that luxury in Genesee County. UMMC is our only hospital. We have to rely on the protections and policies of regulations, Government healthcare oversight, and lastly litigation. One sided public forum debate in this situation will do nothing but harm UMMC's chances of making the neccessary changes to rectify these issues. I think we have made great strides of late. Having Mercy Flight and Mercy EMS set up shop here in our county has put us in a unique advantage of having the absolute fastest trauma response in the area. I would think that the quality of medical facilities played some role in Mercy choosing us. No business is going to attach itself to corrupt and mismanaged facility.
I will go back to my original question, what is the end game here? If UMMC is continually subjected to what amounts in some cases to slander, then we go back to the old adage that perception is reality. It opens up the real possibility that the end result is losing our only Hospital. Imagine a Genesee County without a hospital. Imagine having to go to Buffalo or Rochester for all emergencies, or any medical procedure large and small. Imagine two more empty buildings with little hope of filling them. Sure the Doctors and some of the nurses will move on to other hospitals, but what about the maintanence staff, the custodial staff, the food service staff, the office support. All friends, family, neighbors, and taxpayers looking for work in an area already hard pressed by our economy.
Does UMMC have issues it needs to deal with? I'm sure it does and it should. The original Gerace article may have started out a public service piece, but once opened up to public forum it became something very different. The follow-up poll question just took it to a whole new level, one that will have a lasting impact on the reputation of not just UMMC but our whole area as we strive to build our community.
Jeff, your argument against
Jeff, your argument against an open forum on this topic is very much "head in the sand." Characterize it all you want any other way, but in the end, that's what it is. All you wrote above merely reinforces that conclusion.
This is the perfect forum to have an open discussion about the topic, because it's the only place the whole community can come together -- including UMMC should they choose to participate -- to discuss the issue.
This has not been a one-sided debate as you state. Several people have come on to defend UMMC and point out there own positive experiences and belief in the hospital.
While the hospital may not be able to respond to individual cases, there are plenty of other ways they can respond and bring information to light. They are not without recourse, as you seem to think.
We have nothing to apologize for here, Jeff. We are not in the business of hiding information from the public nor in stifling public debate.
Michele, how can you say the
Michele, how can you say the story was one sided. We quoted Mark Schoell at length. You also say it should be more educational -- we provided a good deal of information on C diff and its occurrences. Further, this is an open forum. If UMMC would like to provide more information, they are certainly welcome to do so. Your accusation of one-sidedness is completely without foundation.
If it had not been for WBTA
If it had not been for WBTA and the Batavian, we would not have know there even was a problem. Don't know about the majority here, but I had not heard of C diff before this and will be more aware of it in the future. Good going Howard!
Thanks, John. The feedback
Thanks, John. The feedback of comments isn't the only feedback we get. I know most people appreciate the coverage.
Suggested poll question: Have
Suggested poll question:
Have you heard of C diff before it was brought up on the Batavian?
Jeff I just wanted to make a
Jeff I just wanted to make a point. Anything said here is not and could not be prosecuted as "Slander" look at this legal definition...
Slander is the spoken or transitory form of defamation of character, a legal term that refers to a falsehood presented as true which could harm the reputation of a person or entity.
Now if we meditate on that we might be able to come to some conclusions. 1) If ummc wants to persue slander(actually it would be libel as this is a form of print media) They would have to prove these statements people are making are false, if it turns out they cant prove them false then what....
Then as far as c-diff and how they handle this and other rampant infections, they would have to show that they PRACTICE regularly the procedures to prevent them...not just have them in place.
Thirdly you dont think that NYS Health Dept would begin to scrutinize this hospital if it started prosecuting for libel, people who communicate a bad experience? Especially if it turns out that such complaints have some credibility.
As Howard pointed out they have the ability to respond, and are aware of what is or isnt being said about them. I prefer to be informed myself and if you look around the hospital and emergency room you'll see signs that ARE posted telling people to S.P.E.A.K. cant remember what the acronym's letters stand for but a couple of them were urgings to question and be Very Vocal and involved in your treatment while at the facility.
Howard, you have done what an
Howard,
you have done what an owner of a news publication is suppossed to do. You broke a story, you gotten over 1300 responses to a poll, you engaged people in debate, and you have generated interest in TheBatavian. In that sense the poll was a success. I however am looking at it from the standpoint of what it may leave in it's wake. I am a lifelong resident of Genesee County, I was born at then Genesee Memorial Hospital, I and my family have had countless positive experiences at Genesee Memorial, St. Jerome, and now UMMC. We once had two hospitals in Genesee County, now we have one, and if this is how we as a community seek to solve the issues at UMMC, we will have NO hospital in Genesee County.
What has been accomplished in this exercise is less people in the area having confidence in our hospital. That equates to people and businesses looking to relocate to our community perhaps second guessing it.
I know we disagree on this but I truly believe in this case that a disservice has been done, not a public service. I said it before, perception is reality and words are like bullets, once you fire them, you can't take them back. Many people will read the posts here and the sad reality is that they will only take away the negative, it is human nature. Without the whole story, they are left with a skewed perception of the hospital. You say that UMMC is free to defend itself and you also know that they would be legally limited to generalities and education pieces while all the accounts of miscare will be left unchecked. I don't discount the experiences of the Geraces, Kyle, C.M.,Scott, Amy, Sabrina, Laura, and Jessica, but the truth is the perceptions of people in their sphere of influence as well as countless others are now driven by their accounts. Any limited, non-specific, educational response that UMMC would be able to put out cannot counter the story of a sick person alleging mistreatment in a hospital.
Jeff you are forgetting a few
Jeff you are forgetting a few things tho..... Words are not like bullets, people can take back what they say or excuse it to high passion of the moment etc. Also I cant believe that if the experiences of a few people like the ones who have posted here are publicly aired. UMMC might not be able to or be limited in their response to the public, but they ARE administrators and as such can take action on the incidents themselves like demotions or removing personnel that constantly get valid complaints. Require mandatory training meetings, and change policies regarding these types of infractions within their own org.
So please dont exaggerate the helplessness of UMMC to much. As Howard said take your head out of the sand and stop painting UMMC and Us with a very generalized paintbrush filled with assumptions. Just so you can justify your opinion, your entitled to it but opinions arent facts so they dont have to be correct. Your just not gonna convince anyone that yours is the right one and everyone elses needs to be questioned.
Kyle, when you said "but they
Kyle, when you said "but they ARE administrators and as such can take action on the incidents themselves like demotions or removing personnel that constantly get valid complaints. Require mandatory training meetings, and change policies regarding these types of infractions within their own org." you hit the nail on the head. My whole point in this has been just that. Policies exist not only at the local level, but at the state and federal level that serve as oversight and correction for these issues. If the hospital's actual track record were indicative of the poll and responses, then how on earth is it still even open? Unless someone is willing to assert that UMMC is paying off investigators not to follow up on claims, then enforcement of policy is the avenue to rectify them, not putting UMMC into the court of public opinion. I stand by the assertion that the poll and subsequent debate are a disservice rather than a means to a solution in this situation. I see nothing gained in further erdoing their reputation.
Jeff, you forgot that I live
Jeff, you forgot that I live in Genesee County, too and have as much a stake in the hospital as you do. While you try to slime me by attributing ulterior business motives, certainly not not unaware of the negative impacts you mention. It certainly wouldn't be in my best business interest for UMMC to go under (as you seem to think possible).
I believe always and forever that transparency and open and honest dialogue is a public service.
"Sunlight is the best disinfectant," Justice Louis Brandeis.
I also stated I think it is
I also stated I think it is who you get. I have had both experiences there good and bad. The experience that I had when I had my second daughter was wonderful. I even wrote a letter to UMMC and the Daily News about it in 2005. However, the experience I had with my 3rd daughter was born was HORRIBLE in 2009 with the nursing care. I wrote a letter to the Hospital Administrator and the nurse manager. I got a basic form letter back saying sorry for your experience if it really happened (at least that is the way I took it). It wasn't acknowleged. It wasn't stated that we will look into this and correct it. There were several nurses that CLEARLY overstepped their scope of work. I pulled my medical records because I had nurses telling me my dr didn't order x, y, and z. Ex. I asked for motrin. The nurse told me my dr didn't order it. Not only had he ordered it, he had ordered up to 10mg lortab for pain (I didn't need lortab, it was there if I had). I actually had to send my husband to the store to buy motrin and bring it back to the hospital for me to take. Motrin is a standard medicine for cramping after birth. For one medicine which I WATCHED him write the order for, I had several nurses tell me it wasn't ordered, they were uncomfortable giving it to me because I had a codeine allergy (I took the one WITHOUT codeine - there were two forms, and several other excuses. I had watched him write the order and had to tell them to go look in my chart, it was there. In November 2010, I was back for surgery and admitted for 3 days. I had absolutely wonderful care with the second floor nurses. I didn't have to ask if this med was ordered or not. The nurses automatically came in and asked me if I needed it or wanted it. They were great on the second floor. We ran into a unique situation where both my husband and I were hospitalized the same day. They communicated what was going on with both of us and took excellent care of both of us. I will say that one thing that was different was that in 2010, a nurse manager popped into my room at some point, introduced himself, and asked me if I had any concerns or issues. Maybe that is making a difference. No one is saying that they want the hospital to close down. What people are saying is there are some issues. They need to be brought up. They need to be dealt with. Would I go back to the 4th floor again? No. Those days are over with for me. Would I go back to UMMC again? Yes. Will I speak up and ask for a patient advocate if I think I am not getting the right care or a nurse and I don't click? yes. You have to be an advocate for yourself. Probably what I should have done back in 2009 was ask for a different l&d nurse. There are things to be done on both sides of the coin.
Jeff.... policies may exsist
Jeff.... policies may exsist of that I have no doubt. But again either because of apathy or the feeling they do enough some dont always get implemented. There is now evidence that this is happening.
As for State and Federal regualtory agencies, your kidding right? These agencies are so overwhelmed with beaurocratic nonsense and too much work that unless a very large and significant portion of our community either fell sick or complained then they would do no moare than a cursory look into things, no bribes or influence is needed just showing UMMC can just take care of immediate concerns and stay open.
No matter how you look at it there is nothing wrong with people airing their opinions and anyone that takes offense to such things especially with a community resource like this makes themselves look like an oddball.
Perception is not reality, that way of thinking really puts you in danger as reality is reality and it will bite.....hard if your not careful.
Jeff, if UMMC was receptive
Jeff, if UMMC was receptive to criticism and demonstrated a 'good faith' effort to address outside concerns, this forum would have projected a more positive portrait of the hospital. Instead, hospital management is defensive (like you). I went the grievance route, making use of the hospital's internal process for resolution. It was a waste of time; like presenting an opposing viewpoint to Tom Reynolds when he was chief fundraiser for the GOP (WNY congressman)- an exercise in futility.
If UMMC wants to earn the title of community hospital, it better stop relying on the boardroom for direction and take the pulse of the people who it serves.
The medical establishment is long overdue for shedding its wall of arrogance.
CM, Rather pathetic to try to
CM,
Rather pathetic to try to tie this important medical issue with your anti GOP bias again.
...That's me, John- pathetic.
...That's me, John- pathetic. ...Just like the politics and greed that drives healthcare policy in this country. How much money did Reynolds funnel from the healthcare industry to GOP coffers? ...Yeah- unrelated! Just like GOP defunding of federal meat inspectors has nothing to do with tainted meat...
Yes, very pathetic. What has
Yes, very pathetic.
What has that to do with UMMC and C diff? Or have you decided Reynolds is responsible for C diff at UMMC today?
deleted, duplicate.
deleted, duplicate.
"If it had not been for WBTA
"If it had not been for WBTA and the Batavian, we would not have know there even was a problem."
That's not true. The story was in the Rochester news on 04/16.
Also, for everyone piling on UMMC, try finding any hospital that isn't having issues with this much larger problem.
"Hospital-acquired infections strike an estimated 19,528 Upstate New Yorkers each year, killing 976 of them and adding $157.4 million to regional health care costs, according to estimates by Excellus BlueCross BlueShield."
"If it had not been for WBTA
"If it had not been for WBTA and the Batavian, we would not have know there even was a problem."
That's not true. The story was in the Rochester news on 04/16.
Also, for everyone piling on UMMC, try finding any hospital that isn't having issues with this much larger problem.
"Hospital-acquired infections strike an estimated 19,528 Upstate New Yorkers each year, killing 976 of them and adding $157.4 million to regional health care costs, according to estimates by Excellus BlueCross BlueShield."
Howard, how was I wrong in
Howard, how was I wrong in pointing out what a news publication does and how you accomplished it. You are a business owner and your job is to make the business successful. In the news industry that means breaking stories, engaging the public in debate, generating interest in your publication, and selling advertising. You can say that your only motive is to bring truth and accountability to your readers, but the bottom line, as in any business, is to support yourself and your family. There is nothing innoble in that, it is the news business.
Just to put this to rest and get things straight, when people come on this sight and call a local institution "awful" and "horrible" with the institution having no opportunity to directly answer the claim, that is called open and honest dialogue and a public service. When I present my opinion without one deragotory word that I don't think this was the proper forum for the debate, I am "sliming".
Jeff, I said you were sliming
Jeff, I said you were sliming by implying, if not outright stating, that my motives are entirely impure, not that you were engaging in debate.
And you continue down that path.
There's no doubt I have a profit motive in running the site, but that's not the only motive and your attempt to paint my position as purely motivated by profit is both wrong and insulting.
And again, Mark Schoell is welcome to register for an account and defend UMMC any time he wants. He can leave whatever comments he likes in defense of UMMC. Your statement that UMMC is without defense is both factually and logically wrong. If UMMC chooses not to engage in a discussion with the community, that's on them, not on The Batavian. There is plenty they could say that does not violate any law or ethical guideline. Your pretense to the opposite simply isn't true.
Howard, I stated 4
Howard,
I stated 4 motivations in my posts:
1.breaking stories - your quote:
"We are not in the business of hiding information from the public"
2.engaging the public in debate - your quote:
"I believe always and forever that transparency and open and honest dialogue is a public service."
3.generating interest in your publication - that is your obligation to advertisers.
4.selling advertising - your quote:
"There's no doubt I have a profit motive in running the site"
I also stated earlier that none of your motivations are innoble, they are simply the news business. I don't see where I outright stated or even implied impure motive, I simply stated you were doing your job and that I happened to disagree with how you did it by posing the poll question. If you feel slimed, wronged, or insulted then I apologive that it was taken that way. But I stand behind my assertions that this whole exercise has only eroded confidence in our local healthcare system and that benefits no one.
Howard, Thank you for the
Howard, Thank you for the coverage its an important story that has been made accessible to the public thanks to this forum.I think we should ask another question and just for the heck of it lets exclude people that are associated in any way with UMMC and see the responses to your the questions asked.I didn't try and slam this hospital in my view just told of a family experience.But I may have been unfair in not saying that I also think this hospital on the whole has very helpful people working there.There gonna be in tip top shape after all this but to keep them there I think they should do mock drills to keep them all tip top I would start with this simple step if you mop a room don't use that same water to mop another room or to mop the hallway this seems like a simple step to take to help reduce the spread of germs but you can see this done there all the time.And install foot washers our feet are the dirtiest things there are look at all the feces and spit we walk through daily we spread it everywhere.
I think we should all keep
I think we should all keep something in mind when we assess all the negative comments and experiences that have been shared in this forum regarding the care UMMC provides...the majority of the population they serve are the elderly. The elderly are the fastest growing population in our country right now. How many elderly people do you know with computers or the internet for that matter? I'm sure there are some technology savvy seniors in our town, but not many. I have several friends who work at our hospital, and they frequently speak of the cards and chocolates, and free pizza dinners that patients and families provide for them on a regular basis. They are receiving praise for their outstanding care and compassion daily. My one friend stated this week that their entire bulletin board is filled with cards from discharged patients and their families thanking them for their positive experiences. When we make a generalized statement about the overall experience the hospital is providing our community, keep in mind that all of us on this online forum make up the hospital's minority group of costumers...the majority of patients they serve will never read these comments or have access to add to them.