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November 7, 2012 - 9:02am

Today's Poll: Are you surprised that Obama won?

posted by Howard B. Owens in polls.
Dave Olsen
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All arguments aside, it has always been very, very difficult to unseat an incumbent President. He definitely had an advantage from the outset. Just sayin'.

Peter O'Brien
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Good job voting yourselves a pay check.

mike nixon
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Last night's mandate was for individual gain. It had nothing to do with, in the very least, the good of the country. The demographics indicate exactly what it was. WHAT CAN THE COUNTRY DO FOR ME. NOT WHAT CAN I DO FOR THE COUNTRY. Sadly it will be unsustainable.

Kyle Couchman
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Care to explain that statement Peter?

anne crotzer
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Well said, Mike, you hit the nail on the head!!

Mark Brudz
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$2.6 Billion spent on this election, and the result

Barack Obama still President (A lame duck President at that)

Democrats still control the Senate 53 Democrats 2 Independants (One a self proclaimed socialist and one a Democrat who ran as an independant) and 45 Republicans.

Republicans still firmly in control of the House of Representatives

The popular vote too close to call a real mandate, no substantial gains or losses in the congressional votes to declare a mandate.

Usually the markets bounce up 100 pts or so the day after an election, today down 312.95 points at the time of this post

so what do we have, sadly, most likely even more gridlock on the horizen.

And for those interested in third parties, here is how the vote broke down as of 3:30 pm today

Barack Obama D 50% 60,085,524

Mitt Romney R 48% 57,401,992

Gary Johnson I 1% 1,155,927

Jill Stein I 0% 403,419

Virgil Goode I 0% 113,887

Roseanne Barr PF 0% 49,380

Rocky Anderson JP 0% 35,475

Tom Hoefling AI 0% 28,588

Randall Terry I 0% 12,895

Richard Duncan UN 0% 12,032

Peta Lindsay SX 0% 7,032

None Of These Candidates ND 0% 5,753

Tom Stevens OB 0% 4,010

Stewart Alexander SO 0% 3,912

Will Christensen CS 0% 3,753

James Harris SW 0% 3,430

Jim Carlson G 0% 3,174

Merlin Miller AT 0% 2,598

Sheila Tittle WP 0% 2,479

Jill Reed UN 0% 2,373

Gloria La Riva SX 0% 1,523

Jerry Litzel I 0% 1,196

Jerry White SE 0% 1,128

Dean Morstad CN 0% 1,107

Jeff Boss I 0% 886

Jack Fellure PR 0% 503

Tim Howe
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The multitudes of lazy people voted for FREE STUFF not for FREEDOM. So sad.

Jeff Allen
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Love him or hate him, David Axelrod may go down as the greatest political strategist of our generation. He took an inexperienced, relative unknown outside of Democratic circles and sold him as a brilliant thinker, great orator, and the hope of our time. After getting him elected and we found out that Obama was at best an average politician, good reader, and terrible President, he successfully took Americas eyes off the realities of our economy, foreign relations, unbelievable incompetence and outright lying on the handling of Benghazi. His strategy of diversion, distraction, and deceit worked brilliantly and while Americans drove to the polls with their tanks full of $4.00 gallon gas, high unemployment, crippling debt, and healthcare costs skyrocketing, got enough people to ask for 4 more years of it.

Mark Brudz
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There is nothing one could argue with you on that Jeff

Howard B. Owens
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Jeff, one must consider that it wasn't so much that people loved Obama (though undoubtedly, many did), but that the alternative wasn't really much of an alternative. Nearly 80 percent of what the Romney offered differed little from Obama, and on the other 20 percent, he wasn't trustworthy.

Mark Brudz
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Howard that was the point, Axelrod developed a powerful media blitz that demonized Romney to the point that people didn't trust him and carried out even before he won the primary.

It was actually a brilliant strategy on both sides, very few people know the real Obama, and very few know the real Romney at this point, Just brilliant strategy all together.

Much of peoples perception of Romney is based on the narrative Axelrods group created, likewise much of the Obama narative.

Jeff Allen
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Oh , I absolutely agree with that. Romney was a marginal candidate who barely made it through the Republican primary process. Millions of voters from both sides held their noses when they voted, feeling trapped by the two party monopoly. I was happy to vote third party. With increased exposure and some voter education through grassroots efforts, maybe, just maybe, we can break this stranglehold by 2016.

Mike Kelly
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Over 90% of blacks voted for obama.

Over 70% of latinos voted for obama.

Over 60% of single females and young voters voted for obama.

Notice; all the job producers voted for obama..........wait........NOT

John Roach
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Mike,
To insinuate that minorities do not work, or that single women and the young do not work is almost beyond stupid, and a reason they voted for Obama.

Lazy people or the kind that want the government to take care of them is not based on race or sex.

Howard B. Owens
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Mike, what an ugly comment.

John Woodworth JR
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Mike you are absolutely right. The mindless and laziness of society won another four years of hand outs. I have several friends make this statement, "It's the evil that we know!" Which proves one thing; they are just sheep following the farmer into the slaughter house.

Like I stated, "We should not just concern ourselves about the greed of the wealthy." We should be concern about the greediness of the poor. They want more and more and more. At least a greedy rich man puts something back into the pot. What does the poor man give back? ABSOLUTELY NOTHING! They just suck the system dry and do not care about being part of society.
Let's face it, what is their drive to work; what is their drive to contribute to society as a whole; what is their drive to self improve if, they get everything they want from Obama?

MINDLESS SHEEP follow Obama! I put my life on the line like many of the members of The Batavian for this country. Obviously, it was all in vane. We just re-elected the down fall of our country and the mindless do not see or care..............

John Woodworth JR
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Howard, why is Mike's comment ugly? It is so very TRUE! I am curious about this? If, everyone who voted for the Obama/Romney because, they did not like Obama/Romney and instead voted for Gary Johnson. Do you think we would have a different President?

Sally Waldron
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Wow some very sad comments here, I am personally upset by those that have such narrow minds to blame all their woes on those that are less fortunate.

Being a person that has worked at Social Services and the Housing sector, you can't say anything unless you have walked a mile in others shoes.

Howard B. Owens
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John, it's pretty obvious and I'm surprised to see you condone it.

Judith Kinsley ...
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Mike's comment was racist and sexist. Simple. For a moment I wondered why you couldn't see that John and then I remembered your previous posts and it made sense. I voted for Obama. I work my ass off every day and pay my fair share of taxes. I am not looking for a handout in any way shape or form from you or anyone else. And no Peter, I don't want your paycheck. I have my own. I am willing to share with those who need temporary assistance to improve their lives and in order to enable them to become productive citizens. More than anything I do not vote for candidates or a party who seek to force their beliefs, religious or otherwise, on me . Obviously I am not alone.

Mike Kelly
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Seems like some people have bad reading comprehension.

I am not implying that these people do not work.

I am saying that these groups are not JOB PRODUCERS who supply work for others. (And if they do, it's a very small percentage)

Sally Waldron
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I think you need to open your horizons to more than western NY, for out west and even in NYC there are many predominate people who are Hispanic and African American along with many single women that are successful in their businesses and in management positions. I still feel that your comment was very narrow minded.

John Roach
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Mike,
It was not bad reading comprehension, it was you poor writing ability to clearly explain your point.

Kyle Couchman
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I feel I have to speak up here. In some ways I can understand and even condone some of the comments made about the "poor and lazy". Because we all know the truth, that they are there and that they flout and show off that fact, and there is a percentage of them that are black, and single mothers and such. It is ugly however and truth is ugly. Now let me tell you my story and it's become clear to me that it's very common. Then consider your generalizations about the poor and the programs they use to get by.

First, I can speak of this as when I came to this area I was an undiagnosed diabetic, I am not your typical overweight and barely working type I actually left a job I did for almost 20 yrs because the business closed and the owner moved on to a different kind of business overseas. I was a 10-15 hour a day worker, plus 90% of the time I was on call, I managed apartments, construction crews and also rented and leased the commercial and residential properties. I was also the maintenence manager who managed the crews by day and handled the more delicate or important projects after hours to keep costs and mistakes down. I also was active in the Ithaca community with common council and politics on behalf of landlords and their issues. When moving here my fields of talent didnt translate well to this job market. I temped in a Hotel in Victor as a service maintenence manager, also held several jobs here because I was like some of you I cant stand not to work or be productive. My local employers always appreciated my work and gave me raises to the best of their ability but because of the economy and so on it wasnt what they or I wanted so we all struggled on. I had many health related issues affect my performance in the last 4 months of my job here that I was forced to take because I couldnt afford gas prices to travel to victor. Because that job was also struggling I ended up changing jobs for one that paid the same but gave me health benefits that I was in despret need of. 2 weeks into that I became ill again, was hospitalized and nearly lost my leg. I had gangrene in soft tissues in my foot under a callous that led to a bone infection. I had to let that job go, and ended up in the hospital over a month, pumped with antibiotics 24/7.

Well here goes the exp I really need to relate...

I ended up on medicaid, also with temporary assistance and such as this injury and recovery required at least 6 mnths of being off work. With 2 weeks only in the job there was no help that could be gotten from workman's comp and because I wasnt able to work I couldnt recieve unemployment. I applied for assistance and got it, It covered half my rent and gave me about 80 dollars a month that went to medical supplies. I took my vehicle off the road and depend now on buses and bicycle to get to medical appointments. I lived with my fiancee (the reason I moved here to begin with) she took on two jobs while studying for her bachelors degree in psychology. We got by everything was reported and between required visits to doctors, wound care and social services I was able to cover what was needed to keep me off the street. But in July this year after living like this for 8 mnths 2 things happened, even though nothing as far as income or expenses changed, when my fiancee and I married in a small ceremony all financial assistance got cut off. The calculation changes and we get only food stamps benefit us which is 180 a month. Also my doctor told me that my wound is not healing, so I was put on another 8 months no work order. Which forced me to apply for ssd/ssi. That takes almost 2 yrs to apply for and get turned down even with valid medical reasons.

So here we have it we were forced into this system and believe me it isnt easy to get financial help with damn good reason. As we see from headlines you have to lie and misrepresent to get assistance (yes I also had people tell me what I needed to do to get assistance while in the welfare office's waiting room) but I dont do that because I have integrity. I have had shouting matches with my Doc and even went to interview for jobs as the decision I was faced with was.... get a job possibly lose foot or leg. Or follow the system and do what I could until I was homeless and lost my medical coverage and everything else you lose once you have no address. I sit here today faced with all the stress, (which complicates my conditions and aggravates the wound I still have) just getting by, things havent changed except that I found out I have a good hearted landlord and that even though my church closed here locally I have a great church family that helps us when we need it. I will get back to work and I will become functional again but in my expereinces most of the people there at the welfare office do need what they get and it's very minimal believe me. There is alot of fraud though too I have sen the people who have the expensive cars and nice clothes come in hand in there paperwork and bitch about about it. They are in the minority but they are there, that is fat that needs to be cut from the program either by drug testing, setting limits or something...

By the way I didnt vote for Romney or Obama, (I couldnt in good conscience) I researched online the other candidates that got almost no media coverage and thought that Gary Johnson was the best choice.

I am lucky I have been able to get by on my wits, by exchanging favor for favor and helping freinds and family with what little skills I have that dont require me to be on my feet. Also having a supportive wife and doctors that care. I will get through this, hopefully intact but if not then I will adapt. I will get back to work again and get back to normal life, the way things look though politically the real interesting thing is what normal life will be defined as by our Govt and by the people if things keep getting worse.

I am not mindless or lazy, but I have legitimate needs that these programs help with. So please consider those of us that do when making these generalizations. Because those who suffer the most in these programs are the ones who truly need it, follow the rules and suffer for it. We will be the ones who lose the most with cuts to these programs too, as those who "work the system" will always do so and be the last to be cut out of it.

Howard B. Owens
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I've known many, many black, Hispanic and women entrepreneurs over the years. Some of the most successful business people I knew in San Diego fell into one of these three categories. Some were multimillionaires from their business ventures. Any kind of generalization based on race or sex is simply wrong.

Doug Yeomans
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Here's a bit of irony for you: http://tinyurl.com/c7jch28

In an election that often focused on debates about class warfare, President Barack Obama was favored over multimillionaire businessman Mitt Romney in eight of the nation's 10 wealthiest counties.

Howard B. Owens
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Charles Murray in his book Coming Apart discusses how in the nation's wealthiest enclaves, the residents are overwhelmingly liberal/progressive. Typically, they're Ivy League educated and have spent their entire lives running in the same social circles and have had very little contact with people outside their sphere. It wasn't always this way, but increasingly, the super-rich are walling themselves off from the rest of American Society. And if you think I'm generalizing, read the book. Murray presents a good deal of statistical analysis (it's actually a pretty dry book, but well researched and the overall thesis is pretty interesting).

Jeff Allen
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Obama was also bankrolled by more multi-millionaires but the left controlled the narrative by continuing to throw around the Koch brothers and Sheldon Adelson. This election was all about controlling narratives and the Democrats did it well

Mark Brudz
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So well Jeff that an Iranian Fighter Jet attacked a US Drone in international waters by firing an air to air missile at it on 1 November and we aren't hearing about it until today

John Woodworth JR
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Sally I am not saying that there are those who are truly hurting. However, look at the rise in numbers that required social services. Why is that? It is not being narrow minded when you know there are those who abuse the system. Those who have given up hope and just stop trying. The numbers are rising because, Obama's policies are based on socialism. How is it that some Welfare recipients earned anywhere between 40-50K adding up the cost of all the benefits and still able to file tax returns? Now Obama gave out free cell phones at the taxpayers' expense. Food stamps recipients are up. Foreign immigrants are a drain on our social services. The system is broken and it is abused. My ex-wife and her family collect welfare and own nine (yes 9) houses on one city street in San Antonio. How is that possible?

Heck Obama recently stated that those who work to augment their welfare benefits do not have too anymore. Like I stated, there are those who truly need help, but there are those who abuse at the taxpayers' expense. Welfare was originally formed to assist the elderly and college students to substain a cost of living during their time of need.

John Woodworth JR
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Wow you are truly a bleeding liberal. Talk about misquoting a comment. RACIST & SEXIST? Really Judith, that is ridiculous! You are truly out of line. The only one that is making it a RACIST & SEXIST comment is YOU! It makes sense why you see Mike's comment as RACIST & SEXIST. You believe that, those who did not vote for Obama are RACIST and those who voted for Romney hate WOMEN so they are SEXIST! Yes my MINDLESS SHEEP comment fits nicely in this situation. Obama will lead use to green fields and we will all reap the rewards to follow. Wake up and you will see the green field is actually a slaughter house, but liberals know best, NOT!

"More than anything I do not vote for candidates or a party who seek to force their beliefs, religious or otherwise, on me ."

Your commnet is obviously a lie. Obama is trying to force his ideas on us. Mindless thinking if, you cannot see that.

Frank Bartholomew
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Is it me, or are there a lot of those who refuse to see what created our current economic mess. Our jobs are being shipped overseas, no osha, no DEC, no unions. How can we compete when we are regulated to death in this country?
Until the field is leveled, this mess will continue regardless of who is in the White House.
Lets boycott products from countries who have poor human rights records, who polute our environment, and don't give a damn about worker safety.
Inform the people of this country, make a list of all American business that have pulled up stakes and left this country for cheaper labor, less regulation, and last but not least, corporate greed.

Kyle Couchman
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Frank I am completely with you on this. No matter who is in the White House, they Govt system is broken and why oh why isnt anyone laying any blame on the other side of the aisle, this Congress and House has fought the whole 4 years with the President didnt matter what he put up or they put up. No one was willing to give an inch, it was 4 years of an ideology war, that ended up costing and hurting us. Corporations and the super rich bitch about taxes and the deficit But are willing to put billions of dollars into an election campaign to fight to get someone elected, it is just a travesty. Just like the unbalanced coverage, there were 3 other legitimate candidates and they were not allowed or invited to debates or barely even covered. No level playing field here which is indicative of how afraid both parties are of the change that is inevitably coming.

Kyle Couchman
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John if you look to the comments I wrote elsewhere yesterday, you will see that these generalizations are hurting people. If your ex wife is abusing the system and they in fact own 9 houses then you need to report it to that county's Social Services offices.

As I stated before there are alot of people that do have a need and follow the rules and get trampled on and the difficulty is that the abusers, who in some cases span generations know the rules an regs inside and out and game they system. Which makes them almost impossible to weed out. Any social worker out there that is reading this can tell you, they know who is abusing the system but cannot touch them because of rules and requirements. Tightening requirements hurts more of the people who are in need and dont abuse before it reaches the abusers.

Its the sad fact that a beauracracy is very ineffecient and terrible under these circumstances.

Judith Kinsley ...
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John, I would rather not start a beautiful Friday with an exercise in futility but here goes: 1) Any statement that generalizes an entire race and/or sex of people is racist and/or sexist. I know I am spinning my wheels here and I am not really interested in explaining what racism is. If you don't know by this late stage in your life, you never will. 2) Do not tell me what I believe. I never said that those who did not vote for Obama are racists, and never would. That is just a ridiculous statement. 3) To call me a liar because I do not agree with the Republican platform and would not vote for it is also a blatantly ignorant statement and is not worthy of argument. 4) Truthfully, if you feel the need to label me a "bleeding heart liberal," that's fine with me. I would wear it proudly. You act as if it is a bad thing. 5) I do not believe for a second your wife owns 9 buildings and is on welfare. (Sounds like class envy!) That would be patently illegal. 6) Document where Obama said that those who are on welfare do not have to work. That sounds suspiciously like a lie. 7) And lastly, just because you put something in caps, does not make it so. Lesson for the day!

Mark Brudz
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Putting this all in perspective, NOTHING IN DC changed this election cycle, NOTHING

Unless something shkes loose somehow, the next four years are going to be nothing but grid lock

Judith Kinsley ...
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I agree Mark. They need to work together and it has not happened. We shall see. My concern over the eventual appointment of Supreme Court justice(s) was a driving factor in my vote. A Liberal will be lovely.

Kyle Couchman
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Honestly I dont think we would have seen much difference even if Romney had won either, Each party heavily controls either congress or the house so gridlock is almost guarenteed. Until the country takes a stand as a whole and makes our reps and elected officals more accountable to us rather than big money interests. We will always be pandered to.

Food for thought: The unGodly amounts of money donated and spent in each campaign... isnt it a fact that if they had just stayed silent and accepted the tax increases on big money interests that they wouldnt have spent nearly as much and realized more money in their pockets? All that money could have put a big dent in the deficit and had some value instead of being wasted on somthing as insubstantial as a campaign. Priorites are so screwed up it really boggles me sometimes.

Mark Brudz
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Kyle, the tax increases amount to about $85 billion, that does not put even a \small dent in the deficit

Remember, 1 Trillion is 1 millilion billions

If you confiscated every penny that the upper one percent earns this year, 100%, you would run the government for 85 days, that is 5 days short of three months

And Judith, I appeciate why you voted becuase of the supreme court, but that is likely not to change much either, The two judges that are most likely due to health to step down in the next 4 years are Ginsburg Breyer both liberals so the court is likely to remain the same as well

Kyle Couchman
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Math was a remedial subject for me but Mark..... a Trillion is only 1,000 billions not 1,000,000

Judith Kinsley ...
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Thanks Mark for the appreciation! I was thinking more along the lines of Justice Scalia. Personal preference. Ruth Ginsberg is a tough old bird and probably would have retired during the last presidential term and her fight with pancreatic cancer if she was going anywhere. Regardless, gives my guys four years of wiggle room so as not to allow it to be the most conservative court ever.

Mark Brudz
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You are correct Kyle, regardless is still no more than spit in a swiming pool. Revenues to federal government will only increase with increased economic activity, deficit will only deccrease with decreased spending.

Bottom line, nothing changed

John Woodworth JR
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"More than anything I do not vote for candidates or a party who seek to force their beliefs, religious or otherwise, on me . Obviously I am not alone."

When you follow Obama's claims "YES" then you are allowing him to force his beliefs. Those who support the Racist and Sexist labeling, then yes you are made to believe nonsense! Yes you are alone since, not one other person referred to it as a sexist or racist statement. Yes a liberal you put your own assumption and spin on Mike's comment.

What is wrong with LIBERALS? Where do I start? First, they are like our judicial system. They care more about others (weaken our immigration laws, support giving business loans to immigrant with less restriction than our own citizens going for the same type of loan, weaken our defense, over zealous in giving hand outs, etc....) Liberals are the cause for this country's downward spiral.

Mike statement did not specifically state race and gender, you and others are assuming that is all he meant. It covers more than just those two issues. You then used that as an excuse to call it Racist and Sexist.

Obama constantly lies and lies and lies. Yes, Obama did state that and it was announced even on CNN. He lied about Libya. He lied to the mindless sheep in Wisconsin. He lied to you and you all were blind.

As far as my ex-wife goes yes, her mom (02), brother Mike (03), brother Cliff (03) and her sister Diana (01) and all collected welfare in Texas. Her Mom and Cheryl lived in one and rented the other. Mike and Cliff both rented two and lived in one. Diana one is no big deal but, she had eight (08) kids and collects welfare and her common law husband James works and supports Diana and her kids. The good thing is the system caught up in 2010 and Mike lost (01) and Cliff lost (02) and since Cheryl's mom past away and left the houses to Cheryl, she lost both and had to move in with her bf's parents. Class Envy not a chance. lmao on that comment.

John Woodworth JR
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Presidents do not control our Nation's economy, but the policies they put in place control the direction it goes. Obama is truly about taking away not just from the rich, but from all hard working Americans and giving to those who are lazy and drained off of productive, contributing members of society! I am a single father raising three(03) teenagers and two are going to college this year and one next year. My Ex does not give me a dime even though she has a job. What is Obama going do for me? Absolutely nothing because, I do not fit his critria for someone in need. Even though I make just as much as some welfare recipients. So Judith can I claim Obama is racist and sexist?

Judith Kinsley ...
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John I would respond if I could find a single sentence that made any sense in that mess. Carry on.

Doug Yeomans
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I know this is a 3 day old thread, but after really paying attention to this election and reading that 8 out of 10 of the wealthiest counties in the nation voted for Obama, I've finally come to face the truth about this country. This country does not exist for you and me. We are just cash cows, servants, slaves and the butt of a lot of jokes in a club that we're not members of.

If people believe that any tax increases will be used to pay down the debt of the country, the debt that has been heaped upon the good people allowed to live in this country, if they believe that any government or corporation has their best interest at heart, those people are delusional.

Happy veterans day, everyone. I'm on my way to the rez to give my money to people that got fucked out of their nation before us.

[video:http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wV1lZMTCqf8]

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